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catallaxy in technical exile

Open forum 20/10/06

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Written by Admin

October 20, 2006 at 10:40 pm

Posted in Uncategorized

416 Responses

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  1. Can’t find the David Cameron post of a few weeks ago. Jason (I think) was having a go at the Tories re tax policy. Their tax commission has reported (170 page pdf) and can be found here (http://www.conservatives.com/tile.do?def=news.story.page&obj_id=133066)

    Please to note they had excellent reviewers on the project.
    Peer reviewers
    “The Commission is grateful to the experts who reviewed the report prior to publication. All acted in a purely personal capacity though their firms and employers are listed below for reference. Some experts wished to comment privately and are not included in the list below. Inclusion in the list below does not of course imply that they or their firms or employers endorse the Commission’s findings.
    Roger Bootle, Managing Director, Capital Economics
    John Bristow, Emeritus Fellow and Associate Professor of Economics at Trinity College, Dublin
    Dr Sinclair Davidson, Professor of Institutional Economics, RMIT University, Melbourne, Australia
    Greg Dwyer, former Director of Tax Policy at the New Zealand Treasury
    Rt. Hon. Lord Howe of Aberavon, Chancellor of the Exchequer 1979-1983
    Ian McCafferty, Chief Economist, CBI
    Mike Warburton, Senior Tax Partner, Grant Thornton.”

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 8:06 am

  2. My lefty friends (I actually know very few right-wingers – maybe righties are too ashamed to admit it so they don’t tall politics) are fond of saying “we no longer have a society, only an economy”. Are they right (I mean as in correct)?

    whyisitso

    October 21, 2006 at 8:08 am

  3. Why would they say that? Do they think that the modest deregulation that has been achieved (since 1985) has destroyed the vast infrastructure of voluntary associations and networks of kin and friends? They need to be asked some more questions to find out what they mean and what they think is involved in having a society in addition to an economy, as they see it.

    Rafe Champion

    October 21, 2006 at 8:14 am

  4. What Rafe said. Is society that fragile? What has changed in 20 years that could have undermined it so much?

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 8:26 am

  5. Hope you drummed some sense into them, Sinclair!

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 8:26 am

  6. I haven’t read the final version. Going on media reports, overall, the recommendations appear to be sensible. They have ruled out a flat tax, but I think that substantial tax reform is better advocated and conducted from government than from opposition. While the Howard government has been tardy in cutting taxes, and spends too much money, they have always argued in favour of fiscal responsibility – i.e. no budget deficits. Cutting taxes in the context of budget surplus is the rhetoric we live with and, in practice, is good policy. I think the Tories picked up on this experience.

    The challenge facing small government advocates is getting government to spend less. Arguing that large tax cuts will starve the beast (or drain the swamp, or similar) doesn’t seem to work. Governments tax less and simply borrow the shortfall. Ideally, governments should tax less, not borrow at all (or smallish amounts to keep the bond market ticking over and the risk-free rate a market price). The lesson of the Howard years, however, has been the value of budget surpluses.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 8:43 am

  7. Its bullshit built on bullshit whyisitso.

    Getting to the first tayer of it there is the simple silliness of confusing correlation with causation.

    So the free enterprise revolution is blamed for things that may well be the delayed effect of currency counterfeiting and government compulsion at every turn.

    We don’t expect free enterprise to SUDDENLY REPAIR overnight or yet even stop the unravelling of trends established under decades of theft, currency debasement and bullying.

    Well thats the first layer. But look another layer. There hasn’t been a reduction in governmental depredation in terms of ACTUAL GOVERNMENT PRACTICE.

    There has been some mild deregulation as Rafe says but the bulk of the change has been in the world of ideas. Not in practical politics.

    So the government depredation continues year after year.

    Where force, thievery and counterfeiting moves ahead then society retreats.

    And the damage won’t be repaired overnight thus lending us clear one-to-one correlation between the policies of the day and general social health.

    There is damage done by socialism that takes decades to manifest itself.

    For example public education. I think I got a reasonable education. But value for money in education has been falling every year thanks to its socialisation.

    The effects of this aren’t going to match the introduction of the original policy. As a matter of fact I don’t rule out that in the early years public education might have done a great deal of good. ‘Socialism never works. But sometimes it takes a long time to fail.’

    Another example of delayed death-blows of leftist would be in energy production:

    Leftists have caused enourmous damage to us but we haven’t really been hurt that badly by it. Thats coming in the next few years.

    So the policy and the effects don’t coincide on a year to year basis is what I’m trying to say.

    If society has been damaged by the left when has economic freedom been given a chance to heal these wounds?

    “we no longer have a society, only an economy”

    So we know what they are trying to smuggle in with that saying. But if you draw them out and try and pin them down on what claims they are actually making you will probably see that they are trying on this bogus correlation that I’m trying to counter here.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 8:44 am

  8. Sorry, Jason. meant to close the italics after ‘should’.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 8:44 am

  9. Thanks, Jason

    GMB – the Laffer curve works over a limited range only. Other thing to note is that very few economists believe us to be on the ‘wrong’ side of the Laffer.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 9:23 am

  10. You don’t know that Sinclair.

    Whats your evidence for this.

    The revenue effect is independent of the public standing of Laffer.

    And it has happened under Presidents Coolidge, Kennedy, Reagan and Bush the younger.

    It has happened overall and pretty much for any tax bracket that was over 15% as far as I know.

    So how can you say it won’t work with another tax cut. Being as it has always worked in America on a 100% hit rate.

    Keep Laffer out of it.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 9:32 am

  11. This access to energy newsletter is a real goldmine.

    This fellow must be one of the gentlemen behind the Oregon petition. The petition which fathead Lambert pretended to have some significant evidence against but actually just provided some distractions.

    Actually this site is like the mirror-image to Lamberts evil Deltoid site.

    Everything is science and clarity here. Whereas with Lambert its all lies, confusion and idiocy.

    Here is one part where the dude shows what a close correlation our temperature has, over the decades, with the heat coming off the sun.

    And its a much stronger correlation then there is with anythinig that the humans are doing….. AT LEAST ON THIS TIME SCALE.

    The time scale being decadal and in terms of just three centuries or so.

    Over thousands of years the human factor might wind up being very important indeed. But after looking at this simple graph you’d wonder why the panic crowd has been holding out on you.

    http://www.accesstoenergy.com/view/ate/s41p791.htm

    Also great video and slide show can be accessed from the main page.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 9:42 am

  12. I’m actually a fan of the Laffer curve (see http://www.cis.org.au/Publications/policymonographs/pm69.pdf).

    If you don’t like Laffer (and that’s fine) think of the following analogy: If a firm changes price what impact will this have of profit? It depends on the elasticity of the demand for the product. In the elastic portion a decrease in price will lead to a proportionality greater increase in quantity demanded and an increase in profit. In the inelastic portion a decrease in price leads to a smaller incraese in quantity demanded and a decrease in profit. Now much the same thing happens in the tax areana. At some point a decrease in tax rates leads to a decrease in tax revenue.

    I believe that a present levels of taxation that a decrease in the top marginal rate would lead to an increase in tax revenue. My evidence is looking at the top 25% share on income tax revenue. Despite the Howard government making tax changes that ‘benefit the rich’ (according to our lefty friends) the tax share of this group has been increasing (what you and I would expect).

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 10:18 am

  13. “I believe that a present levels of taxation that a decrease in the top marginal rate would lead to an increase in tax revenue. My evidence is looking at the top 25% share on income tax revenue. Despite the Howard government making tax changes that ‘benefit the rich’ (according to our lefty friends) the tax share of this group has been increasing (what you and I would expect).”

    Right so where are you disagreeing.

    Before you were saying that we were on the wrong side of the Laffer curve to take advantage. It really doesn’t matter because the optimal outcome is NOT to maximise government revenue but to maximise private revenue.

    But why do you suspect that the cutoff is at our TOP LEVEL.

    Surely its lower then that with (lets say) five years allowed for the turnaround.

    I would think 15% and we are surely getting into great dead-weight loss already.

    Its particularly the link-up between the income tax and the inflation tax…… The two together must be doing the sort of damage like a Hurricane Katrina but spread out more and harder to see.

    So I would think we could get a lot of net gain right down to 15% and beyond. And I would doubt that the rate which maximises the tax take over the next ten years could be more then 15%.

    Because the other thing is we have to take into account this taxes effect on the tax take of the other taxes. As well as the ability to close of some deductions.

    I think you underestimate just how harmful this tax is.

    I think Laffer did too.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 10:43 am

  14. Perhaps some definitions:

    ‘wrong’ side of Laffer curve = RHS on diagram, so a decrease in tax rate leads to an increase in revenue.

    Yes, I agree. We don’t want to maximise government revenue. But we do want to minimise tax rates. In the short run I’d be happy for the government to get more revenue at a lower tax rate. In the long run, the government should set tax rates at the economic growth maximising rate. That, however, requires governments to spend less over time, do less, and severly cut expenditure. There is very little beyond national security and law and order that government should be doing. The population, however, doesn’t buy that argument and would need to be convinced – this takes time, effort, money, relentless small-government think tanks, and political leadership.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 10:56 am

  15. You should have a read of Buchanan / Brennan’s ‘The power to tax’. Classic stuff. (http://oll.libertyfund.org/Home3/Book.php?recordID=0102.09)

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 11:00 am

  16. Right.

    Well I still say the main strategic goal should be to turn the bloodsuckers out.

    Because while great economic gains can be made by cutting the tax rates thats not going to stop this great theiving machine from hiring more people. We want THOSE GUYS to have to work for a living.

    You see if you go for raising the tax-free threshold then when economists say that more is to be gained from cutting the top rate you can just agree.

    See cutting one doesn’t stop you from cutting both. In fact thats the point of the exercise. But going for a narrowly economically-correct agenda isn’t going to get the blood-suckers thrown out.

    So it isn’t going to change the public-choice-theory-pull-factor that just keeps this blood-sucking machine running wild.

    Leave it for others to campaign for the lower tax rates. Agree with them. Then its bipartisan.

    But its only these massive increases in the tax-free-threshold that will allow us to build the budget up from the ground with a view to sending Quiggin, Lambert, Banisch, Norton and everyone else onto the job market.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 11:19 am

  17. ‘with a view to sending Quiggin, Lambert, Banisch, Norton and everyone else onto the job market’

    and Davidson.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 11:28 am

  18. A little collateral damage there!!
    You know what they say, Sinks. To make an omelette you have to break a few eggs …

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 11:30 am

  19. Well yes.

    You see I wondered how it was you were beating around the Bush a little.

    But no-ones got the RIGHT to a public-tit-job and you’ll get a new job in a private outfit.

    Whereas I suspect if we get that far then these lefties will be humiliated by such a marvellous victory. And you’ll have the edge on them for the better jobs in the newly invigorated private education industry.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Jason. Don’t be comparing commies cracking peoples skulls open to cooking or to reducing thieving.

    These are inappropriate and heartless comparisons.

    Show some sort of human feeling.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 11:35 am

  20. All the individuals named would get ‘real’ jobs. But unless the university system were completely abolished, their employers would be loath to lose them. Whatever the ideological preferences of the Quiggin’s, Bahnisch’s, Norton’s and Davidson’s – they do participate in the market for ideas. Universities play an mportant role in that market. And libertarians (even classical liberals) value markets.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 11:47 am

  21. Thats REAL jobs. Not ‘real’ jobs.

    Its not a job when you are spending other peoples money. Not unless you’re carrying some serious weaponry or are otherwise employed in the necessarily (for the time being) socialised sector.

    Look I think the shake-out would be far more serious then that.

    Student loans and grants would be all gone. They wouldn’t make the cutoff.

    Probably the market would turn against full-time study to a great degree and the there would be Council of Adult Education-like programs sprouting up everywhere.

    Who knows. But the point is that if you have to pay for your education you aren’t going to be satisfied with all this crapola that these guys come out with.

    I don’t think they’d do so well. They might do well in the market NOW. But this is not independent of the existence of all this socialism.

    For example the financial sector is socialised. And the Financial Revue is outrageously leftist and employs Quiggin to write these peices for them.

    Bullshitting people can never be considered valid participation in the market of ideas.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 11:59 am

  22. ‘Student loans and grants would be all gone.’

    Student loans need to be introduced before they can be abolished. Now I don’t want this to become a ‘I walked barefoot through the snow, uphill, against the wind, in both directions’, but I did have to borrow from a commercial bank, at 12%, to complete my studies – so I’m a fan of student loans. HECS and FEE-Help and all that are not loans per se. When you borrow from a bank at interest and have to repay in the period you loaned the money for – that is a loan. Concentrates the mind.

    ’employs Quiggin to write these peices for them’

    The AFR pay me money too, and John Roskam, and others. When truth and error collide, truth is strengthened. You can’t have a market without competition. The market for ideas is tough and it should be tough.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 12:17 pm

  23. HECS and FEE-Help isn’t getting over the hurdle of a $30 000 plus $5000 per dependent threshold.

    Your sentimental affection for these things proves my point.

    The cuts aren’t going to be made by slashing income tax rates alone.

    You can’t tell me that having to argue with idiot leftists on economics is a good thing. I know you fashion this idea in a very attractive way but its not plausible.

    You tell me if that was a plausible way of thinking how is it that Keynesianism,,,,, a school of thought that has no merit to it whatsoever and never had any in the first place….

    Has managed to survive.

    I’m FOR open debate. If someone is getting a public tit subsidy that DETRACTS from open debate.

    You don’t appear to be that committed to the cause.

    Although your wording has you as being in favour of open debate, and me somehow being against it… And I suppose I ought to congratulate you for your slickness in that regard.

    Although you would have this reversal on I don’t see you as committed to open debate or to free enterprise.

    The fact is you are a tax-eater.

    And it shows.

    And if your status as a taxeater is going to affect you, as an alleged libertarian, imagine the sum of all those individual influences across the board, and how that would poision open debate.

    This is the very reason why they all must be turned out of the house of vampires to cast about in the sunlight. To cast about to see who it is that can survive proffessionally in the new environment.

    This is WHY they have to get REAL (note not ‘real’) jobs.

    Because this stolen money when spent, sets up a public-choice-theory-pull-factor.

    It sets up that pull factor EVEN WITH YOU.

    Imagine what it does to others?

    Imagine what it does IN TOTAL?

    If you worked for a living….. if you paid taxes…… you would not be sad to see all these people on their way to the casual-work noticeboard.

    Wherever that noticeboard might be located.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 12:38 pm

  24. ‘If you worked for a living’

    Don’t be silly. Nobody wants to work for a living. I get paid to do my hobby.

    ‘ if you paid taxes’

    Regret to inform that despite the recent changes I’m still in the top marginal bracket. I’m very diligent in paying my taxes. I’m sure the ATO and others would love to see a relentless anti-tax advocate being done in for tax evasion.

    ‘you would not be sad to see all these people on their way to the casual-work noticeboard.’

    Where we’re disagreeing is on the identity of ‘all these people’. There are many, many, academics who need a kick up the bum because they are lazy, or stupid, or both. But those you mentioned are neither. Dangerous, yes.

    On universities, I would privatise them all, and require them to list on the ASX to raise capital. I would think they’d sort themselves out pretty quickly.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 1:01 pm

  25. end italic after ‘wants’. Goddamnit. sorry. i’m off to get the new “meatloaf’ album. Thanks GMB for paying.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 1:03 pm

  26. Don’t be so nasty to Sinkers, now Graeme. He’s done a lot for the cause. And I agree with him about student loans – at the end of the day if your degree is useful you pay it off, I don’t see it as a great burden to the taxpayer.

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 1:04 pm

  27. Sinkers may be a taxeater but he’s our taxeater!

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 1:09 pm

  28. Right.

    But look at how his essentially parasitical lifestyle affects him.

    Humming and hawing and pretending that Universities need to be funded, but not really saying that.

    Not endorsing a serious attack on the size of government…

    Sticking up for these leftist liars and devoting all this sophistry to the task.

    And then bullshitting that he pays taxes when thats all smoke and mirrors.

    Then basically gloating that his acceptance of stolen funds puts him at the highest tax bracket.

    He’s not one of our guys. He’s not committed to the cause.

    He’s damaged goods.

    He can only be redeemed via the raising of the threshold and being caste out into the light with the other vampires.

    But you see he wouldn’t endorse the idea. He mucked around a bit and tried to play the slippery eel. Tried to lecture me on Laffer though there seemed no real disagreement.

    He’s got the right idea about Jim Steinmans music. But that produces a bit of a cringe factor in this country.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 1:23 pm

  29. Oh FFS Graeme. You know what we call your strategy? We call it the Losers Strategy. You kick up a stink that unis are full of leftists. Then when one of our guys gets into the country club, you give him shit?

    You’re being an idiot.

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 1:40 pm

  30. Did I say universities need to be funded from the public purse? I did say pivatise and list on the ASX.

    In a couple of weeks the IPA are putting out a backgrounder on a very related issue (public R&D)- should cause a kerfuffle.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 1:58 pm

  31. Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.

    Instead of arguing with facts and evidence you just make shit up.

    I’m not surpised that you linked to the idiots who blamed Rachel Carson for 3 BILLION deaths. That’s more than the total number of deaths from all causes in the past forty years.

    In spite of being repeatedly challenged you have not come up with any scientific support for your idiotic proposal to fight malaria. A proposal, which, if adopted, would cause millions of people to die from malaria. Fortunately it won’t be adopted, but if it was, I’m sure you would not accept responsibility for the resulting skyrocketing of malaria. Because, as noted above, you are a coward. And a liar.

    I’m going to be a bit busy the rest of the afternoon, so here are my responses to your next few comments. Could you be a dear and cut and psate them in at the end for me?

    Thanks in advance:

    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.

    TimLambert

    October 21, 2006 at 2:13 pm

  32. Oh dear …

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 2:16 pm

  33. That’s more than the total number of deaths from all causes in the past forty years.

    Richard Horton, call your office.

    We have your next Lancet “survey”.

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 2:20 pm

  34. Sinkers it was a damned fine paper too.

    I got a great laffer out of it.

    Actually I got a lot of education out of it as well

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 2:26 pm

  35. Homer, are you saying of the IPA that Demsetz on the fence when it comes to what’s really important?

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 2:36 pm

  36. Yeah, go on CL, tell us again how hilarious it is that all those Iraqis have been shot, blown up and tortured to death. Still clutching your sides with laughter?

    TimLambert

    October 21, 2006 at 2:37 pm

  37. IPA CL?

    you are been affected by the draught!

    It was the CIS. The premier think-tank

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 2:41 pm

  38. I dunno Jason. The clientele that hangs out here…

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 2:46 pm

  39. Too right Sinclair. I feel the same way. It getting to be a low rent crowd for my liking too. One of these days I gonna suggest we do a mass sacking and start again.

    That reminds me where’s the youngest professor in the history of the universe or Harvard?…. Parkos. I haven’t seen the scoundrel around these days. Better not speak too soon or the coffin lid will crack open seeing it’s night time in Europe.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 2:53 pm

  40. you mean Homer, Sinclair?
    I agree ..

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 2:54 pm

  41. Sinclair’s last comment was about an IPA paper, Homer.

    Try to be more of a Stigler for detail and join Katz for a draught!

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 2:57 pm

  42. Yea jase. I agree. Homer just ruins the neighborhood. Shocking web person.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 2:59 pm

  43. more wisdom from our Professor Eric Blair:

    http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/10/13/confusing-marx-stalin/#comment-165169

    There will no doubt be a handfull or two of loyal lieutenants of capital who will fight to the death for their right to choose from 57 brands of sugary, crap breakfast cereals in the vain belief that they’re somehow different and that this choice is important. The smarter ones will realise that they’re all either, corn, rice, wheat or sorghum and change sides.

    On the revolutionary side there will be armies of low-paid, pissed off McDonalds employees, Detroit car workers, Korean microchip assemblers, teachers, nurses, bus drivers, airline stewards, public servants, cereal boxers and shelf stackers who can’t wait to take that chicken-leg stupid clown(1) and string him up from the nearest lamp post.

    Once all the shouting dies down and we’ve cleaned up the bloodstains and re-opened the telephone exchange under workers’ control, the Starbucks’ collective, the microchip makers and car workers, the shelf packers and the cereal-makers collective and the mothers’ group can all sit down and work out what the fuck happens next.

    And you know what, I actually think that they’ll get it right. They’ll work it out for themselves, they won’t need any detailed plan, they won’t need market research. They won’t need a bunch of technocrats and party hacks telling them what to do. It’ll be a case of “Right, what needs to be done?”

    People make revolutions, not revolutionaries!

    I’ve said all I need to say. If you want to know any more, email me. I’ll respond to serious messages, but flamers can go fuck themselves with a shovel from here until the revolution! eric-blair@hotmail.com

    Like my cozzie bro says, your taxes (not mine, I’m the Kiwi Bird) are paying this man’s wages.

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 21, 2006 at 2:59 pm

  44. I thought registration would be a barrier to entry. Homer’s one of the good guys. But with puns like that, we will have to shoot him , when the revolution comes…

    Demsetz on the fence, CL? He’s a bit far from your areas of interest. Not that I’m complaining. Everyone should read Demsetz, and Smith, and Coase, and Buchanan, and North.

    How is your reading coming?

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:03 pm

  45. If I was talking about Sinker’s last comment you would be right however your comment is too soon!

    I was talking about Sinker’s own paper he in fact linked!

    Why does JC keep on ressurecting comments. does he have a croos to bear?

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 3:06 pm

  46. Let me guess “Professor” Erci Blair has just channeled “Professor” Parkos by ESP and both these “professors” now think it would be cool to have a revolution. What the fuck has happened to the soft sciences. That’s my question.

    Next time Professor Parkos has a peak I’ll suggest that he tries to meet Professor Eric as they have very similar outlooks.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 3:08 pm

  47. what is 47?

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 3:16 pm

  48. Homes
    I’m just kidding. You’re the last person I would throw out. In fact I would get rid of me before you. That’s how low rent I think i am. In fact I feel sorry for myself having to put up with me.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 3:18 pm

  49. Well I just made another witty comment ( wel it was halway there) which involved you and Mr Soon hasn’t let it through.

    He must be laughing too loud.

    I also mistook CL for the Soon king.

    Damn it. Forgot to take those blue pills again

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 3:22 pm

  50. “Did I say universities need to be funded from the public purse? I did say pivatise and list on the ASX.”

    Its pretty hard to see what you were saying Sinclair. You were acting pretty shifty.
    >>>>>>>>>>>

    Now lets compare this outright leftitst projection, rampant holocaust-denial and outright lying by a our leftist friend. Fathead Tim Lambert.

    Tim Lambert the holocaust denier sez:

    “Instead of arguing with facts and evidence you just make shit up.”

    So sez Lambert. This is a lie of cause and he’s making it all up. What we see here is the leftist projection. And the very next thing Lambert will say IS A LIE THAT LAMBERT IS MAKING UP.

    “I’m not surpised that you linked to the idiots who blamed Rachel Carson for 3 BILLION deaths. That’s more than the total number of deaths from all causes in the past forty years.”

    1. Lambert is lying. I did not link to anyone who claims that Rachel Carson caused 3 billion deaths.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    So Lambert is

    1. Lying.

    2. A holocaust-denier.

    3. A fathead.

    4. A tireless campaigner for the purpose of getting brown children killed.

    5. He just lied about me the first thing he said.

    6. He lied about the people Iinked to the very first thing he said.

    7. He knows that he lied.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    Lambert has been caught flat out in his wrong-doing. But he knows that if you lie enough people will naturally think there is a little bit of wrong and right on both sides.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 3:25 pm

  51. From the desk of professor Eric.

    “There will no doubt be a handfull or two of loyal lieutenants of capital who will fight to the death for their right to choose from 57 brands of sugary, crap breakfast cereals in the vain belief that they’re somehow different and that this choice is important. The smarter ones will realise that they’re all either, corn, rice, wheat or sorghum and change sides.”

    that’s funny he should bring that up. When we arrived back from the states the kids and I would complain about the little choice of cereals in Oz compared to the enormous choice availabe in the US. We were taken aback by this.

    Now Professor Eric wants to reduce it even more!!! What the fuck?
    Does this doofus want to create a revolution through cereals. I know which side I’ll be fighting on. What a jerkoff… wanting to reduce cereal choice.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 3:26 pm

  52. sorry homer but I don’t see anything in the moderation queue. and i don’t know where all these italics are coming from

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 3:28 pm

  53. Sinclair, I did read some Chicago and Austrian stuff a few years ago (pretty basic level) but these days I want to tackle Nozick, more Hayek and a few of the libertarian figures mentioned here recently. I read about the ‘Demsetz auction’ – which I don’t think I understood – and that’s the only reason I know his name. 😉

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 3:29 pm

  54. Me? shifty. hah. You buying the next time I’m in Sydney.

    Speaking of big pigs, ‘In the land of the pig, the butcher is king’ is pretty good on the Meatloaf album.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:29 pm

  55. It looks like Sinks again.

    Liam

    October 21, 2006 at 3:30 pm

  56. Can you close italics in comments simply by closing the tag???

    TEST.

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 3:31 pm

  57. [ahem] the italics, I mean.

    Liam

    October 21, 2006 at 3:31 pm

  58. got rid of the italics (not JC though).
    Sinkers was the culprit again!

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 3:31 pm

  59. Sorry. is close ital or just

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:32 pm

  60. Allright, I’ll stop. technophobes shouldn’t try to italise anyway.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:33 pm

  61. Kiwi Bird II,
    how are you related to our Mr Bird? what was he like as a kid?

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 3:33 pm

  62. Just think of the midset of a jerk off like Professor Eric. The dickhead goes into a fucking supermarket and he starts politiciszing the place. Too much choice in cereals he says. Imagine this fuck’s diet. If he complains too much about cereals it must mean he doesn’t have much of a varied diet.

    jessh imagine sharing a public toilet with his doofus if he’s eating cabbage for the week.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 3:33 pm

  63. I am too bold for italcs

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 3:34 pm

  64. Sinclair, it’s

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 3:35 pm

  65. I meant to say yes you have to use the / to close

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 3:35 pm

  66. We have Munnchkin and Fyador hating Italics. Et to Homer.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 3:38 pm

  67. Et tu….. sorry

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 3:38 pm

  68. Cool. Thank you.

    Serious question for CL. My nephew is getting confirmed or communion or something tomorrow. I’ll be attending a church service (apart from matched and dispatched) for the first time in over two decades. Mrs D suggests wearing ‘trendly’ clothes, whereas I thought a tie would be appropriate for a church service. What is your advice?

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:39 pm

  69. Look Sinclair.

    Why are you (or are-you-in-fact) against putting up the income-free-threshold in the way I suggest?

    You’ve seen what these clowns are like.

    Look at that parasite Lambert?

    Why is it that you stuck up for these clowns if you are a serious libertarian?

    Now Mr Soon seems to have great faith in you. He seems to think that you have not yet GONE-NATIVE as it were.

    Convince me.

    See those leftist university student unions. You can try and start a free-enterprise student union to compete.

    But all such efforts are vain. The idea is to cut the funding of all such outfits. Stop the stealing and the world of ideas has more chance of healing itself.

    And its a matter of urgency. If not for us its pretty urgent to reform the world of ideas for the next black kid Lambert is trying to get killed with his irrational environazism.

    We have Quiggin also in holocaust-denial mode. We have Banisch acting as a tireless conduit for the shabbiest bunch of marxists anyone has seen this side of North Korea….

    And then we have losers that are misleading the kids like Paul Norton and Chris Shiel.

    And we have absolute lunatics like Eric Blair, apparently a lecturer as well.

    These people all with their fangs deep into us, exploiting the worker and doing everything they can to weaken the nation.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>

    What would be wrong with just putting up the tax-free threshold so that none of their salaries could hope to make the cutoff.

    I’m never quite sure whether you agree with me or not.

    You are a shifty fellow and like to be able to have things both ways.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 3:41 pm

  70. FTR, I like italic and Italians. In general, natch.

    Fyodor

    October 21, 2006 at 3:44 pm

  71. I’m not opposed to increasing the tax-free rate.

    I would never be associated with a union.

    I prefer not to look at Tim Lambert – I’m sure there are people who love him, but he’s just not my type 🙂

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:45 pm

  72. Good.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 3:47 pm

  73. Just Note. I hold the record. Getting a one-word comment from GMB.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 3:49 pm

  74. “how are you related to our Mr Bird?”

    That’s between me and the motormouth fathead, Mr Soon.

    ” what was he like as a kid?”
    He was pretty smart.

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 21, 2006 at 3:51 pm

  75. Bravo that man.

    On a heavier note [gulps]: Jason, where are the comments to The Thread of Doom?

    Fyodor

    October 21, 2006 at 3:51 pm

  76. Sinclair, you could always put a tie in your wife’s handbag and see how conservative this particular parish is as you arrive. If you don’t care what other people think or wear, however, a smart ensemble with tie would not be inappropriate.

    For my First Communion, the boys wore black trousers, white long-sleeved shirts and bow-ties. The girls wore veils and white dresses. Regrettably, trendoids did away with this lovely custom in many dioceses during the 80s and 90s. The attire of congregations generally has become more casual in the same way.

    Your wife is probably on the money – most of the blokes probably won’t be wearing ties. I wouldn’t wear shorts or too casual looking a shirt to a First Communion, though. It is a special occasion.

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 4:05 pm

  77. Thanks for that.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 21, 2006 at 4:14 pm

  78. Don’t believe CL he cannot transubstantiate that

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 4:19 pm

  79. I’ll pay that. 😉

    C.L.

    October 21, 2006 at 4:19 pm

  80. sorry to report this Fyodor but we lost our last few months’ content (from when we moved over to this domain). the earlier Thread of Doom is still safe in backup but c8to isn’t going to put everything back until he knows our current arrangements are stabilised.

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 4:38 pm

  81. “FTR, I like italic and Italians. In general, natch.”

    Not so sure about that, Fyador.

    1.You were giggling hysterically when your friend Munnchkin stole my identity and wrote those racist comments about me.
    2.You were egging Munnchkin on at the Troppo site when you thought he had posted under my name
    3 You acccused Jack S of having the racial characteristics of a coward.

    FTR, I think you do have racist tendencies from the above.
    As I said, you can feel free anytime to call me a coward to my face becasue of my race and we’ll flip a coin and see who’s resting on a hospital bed on a drip feed for the next 6 months.

    Maybe you amy want to apologise to Jack S for saying what you did.

    Interesting perspective you have Fyador. You bascially attack people’s concern with Muslims no matter how nebulous, yet we have the above.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 4:42 pm

  82. Oh, look at this rampant political correctness from JC. Always so quick with the ‘racist’ tag.

    Liam

    October 21, 2006 at 4:45 pm

  83. Not really Liame. Specially when I have to compete with an Irishman like you in the hate stakes.

    Personally I couldn’t give shit what my rqace was or whether people hated me for it. I’m quite safe and comfortable in my own skin.

    It’s the part southern frog side of my family I have real fucking nightmares about though.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 4:56 pm

  84. What a dishonest little shit you are though Liam. If I was one of your more politically correct stereotypes,you would be sympathetic. Seeing I’m not you become a smart arse. What a lefty dick you are.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 5:08 pm

  85. Here are the details on the folks who reckon Rachel Carson killed 3 BILLION people.

    Graeme Bird used up a couple of these, so here’s a recharge:

    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.

    TimLambert

    October 21, 2006 at 5:24 pm

  86. What do you know. The liar links to his own lying blog.

    As the holocaust-denier ALWAYS does as part of his lying distraction.

    This is what holocaust-denier Lambert said:

    “Instead of arguing with facts and evidence you just make shit up.
    I’m not surpised that you linked to the idiots who blamed Rachel Carson for 3 BILLION deaths. That’s more than the total number of deaths from all causes in the past forty years.”

    Now the holocaust denier was lying on all counts.

    Lets see the evidence you inhumane-fat-fuckhead!!!!

    And evidence doesn’t mean linking to your own heavily censored blog.

    GO!!!!!

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 5:53 pm

  87. Where did Dr Art Robinson say that Rachel Carsons influence killed 3 billion people.

    This is such a lame and filthy lie (you gleeful ****) you better come up with the information before I show up and SERENADE YOU (EDIT BY ADMIN)

    GO!!!!!

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 5:55 pm

  88. try and be nicer to TimL, Birdy. He had the guts to show up and argue with you.

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 5:58 pm

  89. So you see fans of liberty.

    Thats all there is in the way.

    Useless fat liars like this computer-guy posing as a scientist putting up distractitons, outright lies and totally bogus arguments.

    But its enough to hold things up and block things.

    Its enough to lead to 300 million unnecessary cases of malaria.

    So its not enough to be pretty fine on policy like some sort of Andrew Norton clone.

    We have to beat these guys at every turn. And you never let these assholes get the last word in.

    We have too many Hayek fans who take great pride in themselves on being sort of in-the-middle and reasonable and having better policy ideas to the lunatic bigshots who have the higher places in academe.

    But thats not good enough. Because these guys are winning at every turn and the thieving still goes on the constant Lamberting means thousands of black kids will die this very day because of stupid restrictions and anti-capitalist bile.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:00 pm

  90. “try and be nicer to TimL, Birdy. He had the guts to show up and argue with you.”

    He’s gut stomach. He’s got PUKU. He’s got a belly. But he has got no guts.

    He showed up and lied about me, about Dr Art Robinson…… And then he linked his own blog.

    Spare me your nazi-accomodating good-German act Jason.

    You should be putting pressure of the gutless-fat-belly-fuck to retract his lies.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:02 pm

  91. “The late Dr. J. Gordon Edwards estimated
    that 190 people per minute are either
    dying or suffering directly or indirectly from
    the USA ban of DDT and other pesticides. ”

    This is where Lambert is getting that 3 Billion figure from.

    1. It doesn’t refer to deaths.

    2. Its likely a very bad estimate in any case.

    3. Its got nothing to do with anything I linked or Dr Art Robinson or The Oregon Institute of Science.

    4. It relates to people
    (a) dying from malaria
    (b) suffering indirectly from malaria
    (c) sufferning directly from malaria.

    Its got nothing to do with any body counts.

    So Lambert just lies.

    The thing about Fyodor is that Fyodor is really dishonest about a subject that people tend to be illogical about in any case. And he throws in the odd straight lie.

    This makes him a bit harder to contend with then this fathead holocaust-denier.

    Because Lamberts lies are so obvious, straight and direct. There is just no Finesse to them.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:14 pm

  92. ““Instead of arguing with facts and evidence you just make shit up.
    I’m not surpised that you linked to the idiots who blamed Rachel Carson for 3 BILLION deaths. That’s more than the total number of deaths from all causes in the past forty years.”

    Retract your lies black-killer. Or back them up.

    GO!!

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:16 pm

  93. Tthe Quiggler is as close to religious rapture one could get without believing in the almighty. Why? Err, because they had to close down some important freeway in Brisbane, which meant that few vehicles are being used. In Quiggland this is a good thing; a great thing. He’s almost orgasmic as a result.

    It’s ok for the quiggler because he says he can catch a ferry to get to his government supported, tenured teaching position probably at 11 am in the morning.

    The certain Nobel laureate (well, according to some) doesn’t give much thought that this could cut down on a lot of efficiency getting goods to and from various parts of the city. Moreover it could actually mean that we could end up using more energy too, if travel time is increased. People seem fine with catching public transport he says. He moonlights, as an economist while his full time job is a mid reader these days. He can obviously tell people are happy with the closing just by reading their minds. Brisbane is one of the largest spread-out cities in the world, so travel time could be greatly increased if a major expressway is closed down. The quiggler could actually be misreading the look on people’s faces. They could actually be tired shitless from having to get to and from work in public transport.

    This is a perfect example of why reasonable people consider some of the species people haters. He couldn’t give a flying shit about the hardship this closing could mean. It just makes him feel good that people are having a hard time of it while he is sitting his fat arse on a ferry.

    FFs, this guy was supposed to be on the top list of thinkers and shakers in the country.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 6:26 pm

  94. This is a very angry site this weekend even by catallaxy standards. Let’s all relax and enjoy the spring weather.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 6:28 pm

  95. JC
    the Quiggler does karate. I don’t think you can accuse him of having a ‘fat arse’.

    Just sayin …

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 6:29 pm

  96. Admin question people (which you can all answer to help me out).

    When I put www in front of catallaxyfiles, I get lots of odd control characters where people have put apostrophes, hyphens and links in their posts or comments. If I drop the www, however, this disappears.

    Why?

    I am running firefox, btw.

    skepticlawyer

    October 21, 2006 at 6:35 pm

  97. “This is a very angry site this weekend even by catallaxy standards. Let’s all relax and enjoy the spring weather.”

    Not until that fat holocaust-denier/holocaust supporter retracts his lies.

    You know he does the whole thing on secondary sources.

    He scours sources of REAL scientists looking for them to QUOTE SOMEONE saying something that is hard to support without the original source.

    And then because that person has QUOTED SOMEONE ELSE the black-baby-killer then shamelessly attributes the quote as being the attitude of the quoter.

    Whereas it could be just a quote.

    Or it could be a MIS-PRINT or a MISTAKE.

    But we’ll never put the time in to track this down. Because this guy is in the distraction business.

    We bust him so many times with his bullshit. But it doesn’t matter. All he needs to do is throw out a smokescreen.

    And yet in a couple of months I’ll be on some American site and someone will be citing Deltoid for evidence.

    This guy is a fraud.

    If we can’t get these people off the public tit via political measures we ought to show up at his class, sock him in the guts and drag his fat ass out.

    The problem of the corruption of science and education has gotten far more serious then people seem to think.

    Imagine conflating Access To Energy in with this 3billion figure on no basis at all.

    Just a fucking liar.

    He’s no my break nose on site list no question.

    He could have repented and he could this minute be campaigning in favour of DDT.

    But he chose being a fat fucking holocaust-supporter over doing the right thing.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:43 pm

  98. “C
    the Quiggler does karate. I don’t think you can accuse him of having a ‘fat arse’.
    Just sayin …”

    A fat old guy VOGUEING around the room hardly makes him Bill Superfoot Wallace now does it.

    He SAYS he does Karate. But he’s a leftwinger. You can’t trust anything they say.

    If they say they are eating a sandwhich its probably a burger or they aint eating at all.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:47 pm

  99. “Where did Dr Art Robinson say that Rachel Carsons influence killed 3 billion people.”

    Lets have the proof then you fucking lying bastard.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 6:48 pm

  100. GMB
    He looks like he could whip your butt so you better watch what you say
    http://www.seiyushin-karate.com/seiyushin_photo11.htm

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 6:50 pm

  101. I reckon Birdy could just call yobbo. Yobbo claims to be the undefeated blogdom champion of all time.

    Actually that would be a great Ultimate Fight contest between the Quiggler on the left and yobbo on the right. That would be a great UFA to promote.

    odds 10:1 on for yobbo 1:1 the Quiggler. No holds barred except gouging, pulling hair, nose ripping. Everything else fair game. Naturally I would be a fair ref.

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 7:08 pm

  102. Well he’s got to be better at it then at the economics.

    He’s still buying into that economic fallacy where you are supposed to run deficits sometime in the cycle.

    When I called him on it he did a runner.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 7:18 pm

  103. Yo, GMB, can you respond to my emails please? Thanks.

    Daniel Barnes

    October 21, 2006 at 7:36 pm

  104. Right.

    No worries.

    I don’t check them all that often. Will look into it tommorrow at the latest no problem.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 8:20 pm

  105. Bird, you are just like Trofim Denisovich Lysenko. Like you, he didn’t believe in Darwin’s theory of evolution but his own version. And both of you proposed policies based on your bogus theories that would kill millions. And both you of wanted wanted Stalinist purges of the all your opponents from the academy. The difference is that his policies and purges were actually carried out and fortunately no-one is going to do what you want, you genocide-promoting Stalinist.

    Oh, and here’s a recharge:
    Please cut and and paste one at the end of each of your comments.

    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.

    TimLambert

    October 21, 2006 at 8:53 pm

  106. Hurry up and back down from your lies you fucking fat fuck.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 9:12 pm

  107. Where did Dr Art Robinson say that Rachel Carsons influence killed 3 billion people?

    That was your claim fatty.

    Lets see you back it up then you stupid fucking lying prick…..

    GO!!!!!!

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 9:13 pm

  108. What you are witnessing here is pretty much the norm amongst leftists.

    Lambert, busted telling flat out lies in support of his holocaust-denial and promotion is pulling the leftist projection.

    It is HE who has campaigned tirelessly against DDT use and in favour of the mosquitoes.

    So now he claims that it is ME that is advocating policlies that would get millions killed.’

    That he is such an evil useless peice of genocidal excrement as to campaign against DDT in the first place is bad enough.

    But now the *** is trying to incite me into WRITING HIM A LOVE POEM (EDIT BY ADMIN) by insulting these dead black kids still further and SAYING THAT IT IS ME THAT IS ADVOCATING the genocidal policies.

    What a fucking worthless waste of space this prick is.

    And we simply have to cut the funding of all these parasites. Black-hating and genocidal or otherwise.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 9:19 pm

  109. John Quiggin is not allwed to fight as he was beard from it!

    why doesn’t Birdy have a sense of humour?

    Bring Back EP at LP

    October 21, 2006 at 9:22 pm

  110. Birdy
    The Sooning was for threats of physical violence and the removal of your reference to fictional sexual practices was because Lambert is married with children.

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 9:25 pm

  111. I love wars. this is better than the dvd I hired tonite

    that’s the other thing about Oz, the selection of dvds is real shitty. And what’s with all the foreign movies section. Who the hell ever watches a frog movie anyway. The acting is bad and they’re so boring.
    Hollywood for all it faults stil does the best stuff.
    .

    jc

    October 21, 2006 at 9:36 pm

  112. I don’t mind a bit of SOONING.

    Just so long as you admit that Lambert is a liar.

    I mean if anything has been established beyond any doubt then this is it.

    The frustrating thing with Fyodor is its difficult for the laity to know just how dishonest he is by watching him in a single sitting or on any given day.

    Now I understand that which is why I hate that little fag so very very much and why I think he’s so poisonous.

    But look at this fathead liar Lambert.

    His lying is so clear and consistent.

    But mostly what he does is just throw up red herrings and refer back to his highly blocked and censored site.

    But there is something very frustrating about this. A watered-down version of the Lamberts lunacy is usually accepted as the consensus.

    Now this happens for NO GOOD REASON.

    Everytime we look closely at the DDT scare or the holocaust-denial thesis or the catastrophic-warming thesis we simply do not find the evidence for all of this SHIITE.

    And we would see this if Lambert and all the lunatics like him weren’t out there just confusing and getting in the way of public debate.

    So we have to look at a new set of rules for debating I think.

    We have to come down on liars or we will spend all our time mucking about on the computer and never get anywhere.

    And what would be the point of that?

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 9:49 pm

  113. Dear Mr genocide man, I see that you are lying about my comment policy, just like you lie about everything else. There is only one person in the entire world banned from commenting on my blog. I don’t allow personal attacks on other commentors. Pretty much everyone who comments there has no trouble with this.

    Anyway, it’s a good thing no-one listens to a Stalinist like you.

    Oh, and here’s a recharge:
    Please cut and and paste one at the end of each of your comments.

    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.
    Mr Bird, you are a liar and a coward.

    TimLambert

    October 21, 2006 at 10:10 pm

  114. Now are you going to retract your lies about Access To Energy claiming that 3 billion had been killed by Rachel Carson?

    You keep this continual lying up pal I’ll be campaigning directly that you should be sacked from your job.

    No-one should be on the public tit for teaching. But anyone who *** as much as you ought not get anywhere close to the kids.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 10:29 pm

  115. Here is Dr Art Robinson on the radio.

    http://www.policestateplanning.com/global_warming.htm

    Listen to him and don’t bother with that Fat computer programmer. Who is no scientist. But just an irrational leftist and gleeful holocaust-denier.

    Jeepers c8to. You sure attracted a lot of shabby leftist nitwits for lecturers.

    GMB

    October 21, 2006 at 10:35 pm

  116. You’re calling Kirchner a leftist? You’re nuttier than I thought.

    Jason Soon

    October 21, 2006 at 10:49 pm

  117. GMB: ‘you fucking fat fuck.’

    Cozzie bro, people who live in glasshouses shouldn’t throw stones …

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 21, 2006 at 11:14 pm

  118. Hey Stalinist Guy, since you want to get me sacked I’d thought I’d help by writing the letter for you. Just cut and paste.

    ————————————-

    Prof Fred Hilmer,
    VC UNSW
    Dear Professor taxeater,

    One of your academics has written something I don’t like. I am against free speech for anyone who disagrees with me, so you must sack him right now.

    Yours sincerely,
    UberSupreme Commander Graeme Bird, GGE (Gratest Genius Ever)

    —————————————

    TimLambert

    October 22, 2006 at 12:36 am

  119. Fred’s at Unsw? I was wondering where the little “CEO” ended up.

    Can I write another letter to Fred?

    Dear Professor Fred:
    I once owned stock if Fairfax because an idiot broker buddy talked me into buying it with the view that it was going to be taken over. I waited and waited but no suitor turned up. All I got was a trimming down of the capital I put up while the broker friend was bawled out for being an idiot. That made two very unhappy campers.

    Fred, was the reason you bought the Internet dating service –RSVP- because you wanted a foot in the door with all the pretty gals in the 20/30 age group? Some jokers even said you bought a rug to cover up the baldness and make you look younger hoping you would score after buying RSVP. Was that right?

    Jessh, I could do a better job than Fred at UNSW. I even reckon Professor JC has a nice ring to it.

    Move over Fred, there’s not enough room for two bumbling idiots as head of UNSW, as I’m better than you at ruining things although after Fairfax, it would be a toss up. I’m also take myself far less serious than Fred.

    Tim,

    How would you like it if by some act of God I became your boss? That’s right Professor JC Chancellor of UNSW.As long as I got a Bloomberg as part of the package I take that job is a flash. Imagine that? Chris Sheil would have to call me professor!!!! FFS I’d do that job for free and no Housing allowance.

    Professor Graeme Birdy could come in as my vice chancellor and Soon could run the medical school with an immediate change in title to Professor Jason Soon- head of medical science and department of Economics.

    Tim, I’d make you professor in a flash, dump the head of IT and give you that job as long as my Bloomberg ran faultlessly. Of course I would run the endowment fund and “agree” to a 20% cut in trading performance fees.

    I reckon Professor JC has a nice ring to it.

    I’d even give Liam a job as VC Birdy’s personal assistant

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 1:33 am

  120. If they dumped Fred in preference to Professor JC running UNSW I would immediately restructure the entire universityto look like this

    Here’s what Chancellor JC’s vision for the UNSW would look like.

    · Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
    · Australian Defence Force Academy
    · Australian Graduate School of Management
    · Faculty of the Built Environment
    · Faculty of the College of Fine Arts
    · Faculty of Commerce and Economics
    · Faculty of Engineering
    · Faculty of Law
    · Faculty of Medicine
    · Faculty of Science

    New vision
    The Defence Academy and Fine arts.
    Fun to watch class interaction

    Law, Arts, The built environment and science
    Lawyers and scientists would be better off on building sites.

    School of medicine, commerce and economics
    Doctors and economists never know what’s going on anyway. Great fit.

    Engineering :Leave:alone:-too much respect for those guys

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 2:29 am

  121. See the marxist Lambert. Not only is he projecting his commie tendencies onto me. He’s delegating the mass-slaughter of leftist behaviour onto Stalin.

    This in itself is a bit of a giveaway.

    “Prof Fred Hilmer,
    VC UNSW
    Dear Professor taxeater”

    Yes you are saying me a great deal of time holocaust-denier.

    Now fathead. Where did Art Robinson make the case that Rachel Carsons influence has caused 3 billion deaths….

    Retract your lie holocaust-enabler.

    GO!!!!

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 7:07 am

  122. I meant to explain this other trick that these marxist leftists always pull.

    Instead of retracting their lying they keep a fight going until such time as people cannot see any difference between the two parties. Until the average punter says: ‘A pox on both your houses’ in effect.

    Now Lamberts just a liar.

    I established that beyond doubt yesterday if any of you were unaware of that.

    But we can never expect him to back down. Instead he’ll just got through all the leftist projection routine.

    I am forced to match it until Jason clamps down on the holocaust-deniers lying.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 7:14 am

  123. damned the link didn’t work, never mind.

    Boy that thread had me laughing for 5 minutes straight.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 11:09 am

  124. I can’t get into see it anyway.

    These anarcists have me blocked from their website.
    >>>>>>>>>>
    Hey this Art Robinson is pretty cool. An old guy now of course. But a real scientist. Right down to being quite eccentric.

    Neat that he can do original research from a farm in Oregon.

    http://www.independentscientist.com/

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 12:00 pm

  125. I don’t know Graeme. Tom Bethell is promoting him? The silly creationist guy?

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 12:10 pm

  126. You’re being irrational.

    We are not going to Tom Bethel or Art Robinson for their theology. And if we are dealing in science we might try and be a bit understanding when the topic turns to evolution.

    This is the terrible thing that we see everywhere. Made more terrible that we don’t have a good phrase for it. It would be like me deep-sixing all of Poppers thinking simply on the basis of him affecting to throw out Induction.

    I don’t know what to call the thing.

    But I know its opposite.

    “The Halo Complex”

    You got the “anti-Halo” complex.

    Its really about:

    1. overestimating the human being….. Human beings are basically almost all addicted to some substance or religion or other. If its CHRISTIANITY then we know what it is and can allow for it.

    2. Really I don’t want to get too technical here. You are being a BIGOT.

    You should be able to spot a REAL scientist when you see one.

    See fatty-Lambert the holocaust-denier…. His reasoning is poor and evasive.

    He is no scientist.

    See Art Robinson.

    His reasoning is STRONG and Accessible.

    He is a scientist.

    And I just don’t see too many of them around.

    Plus he’s a solid libertarian. And the only funding his institute took from the government was these manuals and things they produced about civil defense for homeland security.

    This is the real vision of how a scientist ought to be.

    Did you check out his 52 minute lecture debunking (catastrophic) global warming?

    Just look at the leftists. Its so very hard to get any actual SCIENCE out of the bastards. They are already making plans to steal money and regulate us and so forth that the science is like yesterdays news.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 12:26 pm

  127. OK fair point, Graeme. Guilt by association is an unfair call on my part.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 12:28 pm

  128. But have you checked out his lecture that I linked.

    And his radio spot?

    When fatty-Lambert the holocaust denier goes to run the guy down it WON’T be about the inherent reasoning of the science.

    There will be something else.

    You want to know about these things?

    Aren’t you doing some work where this is a factor?

    Well find out about it.

    Here’s the man.

    I’ve put the links up.

    Too easy.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 12:37 pm

  129. Do they think that the modest deregulation that has been achieved (since 1985) has destroyed the vast infrastructure of voluntary associations and networks of kin and friends? They need to be asked some more questions to find out what they mean and what they think is involved in having a society in addition to an economy, as they see it.

    Rafe, many organisations that provided these services have declined in numbers and energy. While friends and kin networks may not have declined, community groups that filled the gaps between individuals and the state have declined.

    The CWA, for example, was a mainstream organisation of rural women of all ages and could broadly be regarded as representative of non-Aboriginal women living beyond the capital cities. Now its members are few and their average age high, and the CWA is a small and quaint social presence rather than a large and powerful one.

    Sporting clubs are another example of an activity whose perception has changed: sport is an activity that one watches rather than participates in.

    Today it is generally assumed that people with young families are simply too busy to participate in organised voluntary activities for those who are not relatives or friends. This was not always the case. Likewise, those who have newly retired are expected to enjoy themselves by means other than pitching in to voluntary organisations. The major parties find it increasingly hard to staff polling booths on election day as ageing members whose commitment remains undimmed can no longer stand around for ten hours a day.

    The above examples have led to greater government subsidies to fund areas funded with voluntary labour and private donations. The latter two examples can be linked to publicly-funded obesity campaigns and publicly-funded election campaigns.

    The decline of organisations between the individual and the state whose role is not to generate financial profit for shareholders or other economic stakeholders is real, and is lamented. The question is, what is to blame for this.

    I am not sure whether economic deregulation is necessarily to blame for this. A greater expansion of the state into these activities (imagine Meals on Wheels as a state enterprise) would have seen a degree of quietism leading to the same decline in social capital. Alternatively, it would have inspired a resistance movement that would have reasserted the private interest in the gap between the realm of the individual and that of government, which would necessarily lead to not only smaller but (much more importantly) fitter government.

    Andrew Elder

    October 22, 2006 at 1:21 pm

  130. But its only these massive increases in the tax-free-threshold that will allow us to build the budget up from the ground with a view to sending Quiggin, Lambert, Banisch, Norton and everyone else onto the job market.

    I hate to tell you this, Birdy, because I know you like ideological blindness, but I’m not a tenured academic and make a fair bit of my income from… er… working in the private sector as a consultant.

    Just sayin…

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 1:25 pm

  131. Where did those italics come from?

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 1:26 pm

  132. Fixed, Mark.

    Damned italics, always stirring up trouble. Why can’t they assimilate?

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 1:29 pm

  133. Mark
    Birdy has had you in his gunsight ever since you brought in that Eric Blair fellow. Best to wear some kevlar when you venture outside LP.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 1:31 pm

  134. “Rafe, many organisations that provided these services have declined in numbers and energy. While friends and kin networks may not have declined, community groups that filled the gaps between individuals and the state have declined.”

    This is interesting because even the wording suggests and obvious answer:

    “..community groups that filled the gaps between individuals and the state have declined.”

    In your mental model here you have the individuals…. then you have the State……… and between these two entities you have THE GAPS…… that used to be filled by COMMUNITY GROUPS.

    Well whats going to happen when we blow up the government sector into a big fat leach.

    Under your mental model this leach would blow up encroaching on the gaps and would squeeze the community groups out.

    Do you doubt that this has happened?

    Is there some sort of converging evidence that this HASN’T happened?

    Now there seems to be some sort of leftist thesis about the place blaming it all on free enterprise and deregulation.

    Though this (leftist) model might be quite fixed in our minds is there any real reason to believe it?

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 1:32 pm

  135. People shouldn’t assimilate me to TEH COLLECTIVE, Jason. Just sayin…

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 1:45 pm

  136. “I hate to tell you this, Birdy, because I know you like ideological blindness..”

    You are lying Mark.

    You are lying about me liking ideological blindness.

    I FUCKING HATE IDEOLOGICAL BLINDNESS.

    I hate it so very very much.

    And you are lying that you hate to tell me this.

    And you are likely lying about the proportion of money you get from private sources. Or you would be if you ups and gave us the figures no doubt.

    Right…. I’ve just re-read your post. And I see you claim that you make “A FAIR BIT” from private work.

    A FAIR BIT?

    Now since I DON’T have the figures I have to go on how I would have worded it.

    I would have probably changed the phrase “A Fair Bit….”

    To something like “Next-to Fuck-All”

    I deduce this from your other bullshit. But do please give us the proportions and figures.

    And you wouldn’t likely be getting that private work but for the government job that you hold.

    And the private sector wouldn’t likely go for this JIVE if it were a free country and a free market.

    Now if I’m wrong WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING. If you can make a good living on the private sector why don’t you go right ahead and do that full time. So that you will share the burden of carrying the big leach with the rest of us.

    In any case you’ve all got to be thrown off the public tit.

    Then we will see if improvements in the public debate gained by removing that PUBLIC-CHOICE-THEORY-PULL-FACTOR will still leave us with a situation of ex-government bigshots still selling nonsense to the private sector now that they are not locked into the guild-of-thieves power-structure.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 1:47 pm

  137. Wherever community groups have been active and broadly-based in addressing an area of policy, government has generally stayed out, except to make a grab for attention with a small amount of funding or the photo of the local MP looking as though he/she is taking an interest.

    Under your mental model this leach would blow up encroaching on the gaps and would squeeze the community groups out.

    You can’t squeeze out people who aren’t there. I can’t think of a single instance where volunteers were perfectly willing, able and effective in delivering a service and were bound and gagged by government – I’d be fascinated to see an example.

    What’s happened is that a service people took for granted is no longer being provided, and that those people voice their disappointment, and that government provides a compensating service at greater cost than was possible when provided by non-government entities.

    Meals on Wheels is an example of this. Demand for this service increases, numbers of people willing to do it decreases. More and more public money is being spent on this service, but typical responses do not apply: MoW recipents are not “taxteaters”, and MoW volunteers are hardly beneficiaries of some lurk/bonanza.

    Andrew Elder

    October 22, 2006 at 1:50 pm

  138. Sorry, Birdy, I’m afraid I don’t intend to discuss the particulars of my income on Catallaxy. But FYI – the reason why I’m not working in full time academia at the moment is I’m interested in exploring other opportunities.

    I’m involved in a few start up businesses at the moment which are at the stage of raising capital. What, pray tell, have you ever done for innovation and capitalism except post blog comments all day long?

    Put your money where your keyboard fingers are, dude.

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 1:55 pm

  139. Or your ideas.

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 1:57 pm

  140. “Under your mental model this leach would blow up encroaching on the gaps and would squeeze the community groups out.

    You can’t squeeze out people who aren’t there. I can’t think of a single instance where volunteers were perfectly willing, able and effective in delivering a service and were bound and gagged by government – I’d be fascinated to see an example.”

    You claimed that they WERE there. You claimed that they WERE there and now they are not….

    So what is this nonsense:

    “You can’t squeeze out people who aren’t there.”

    So stop me if I’m wrong. But weren’t you explaining to Rafe that they WERE there. And that there has been a break-down. And that they aren’t there now TO THE SAME DEGREE as they had been.

    Isn’t that pretty much what you were saying?

    But NOW you say:

    “You can’t squeeze out people who aren’t there.”

    Well as a matter of fact you CAN squeeze people out who aren’t THERE.

    You can indeed. You can make it harder for them to ARRIVE.

    But thats not my main problem here. It is getting more and more evident that you are carrying some sort of agenda and you are not being straight with us.

    You implied these social relation WERE THERE did you not?

    And now you say:

    “You can’t squeeze out people who aren’t there.”

    You appear to be trying to be sneaky.

    I can tell you its not going to work.

    Now lets go over your argument again. This is the same request as on the other thread.

    See if you can CLARIFY your thesis. Since we can only test it if it is clear.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 2:07 pm

  141. “I’m involved in a few start up businesses at the moment which are at the stage of raising capital. ”

    What the FUCK would they want YOU for?

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 2:10 pm

  142. Shit Mark.

    You are starting to sound more and more like Nabs.

    Next you’ll be telling us you are an arms trader.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 2:11 pm

  143. Heh.

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 2:17 pm

  144. I will just say Nabs is a good fella to share a single malt whiskey or two with.

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 22, 2006 at 2:17 pm

  145. Maybe for you.

    I’d have to bring a book or two.

    If I want to have an intelligent dialectic, I’ll head into town and hit Jat San Xus’ buzzer.

    Or alternatively I’ll just stay home with my chin on my left hand and a beer in my right.

    Congratulations on your new business(es).

    But it aint redemption until you turnaround the information your site is putting out with a view to helping and not hurting this country.

    And it aint services to the Australian economy until those businesses have paid their debts and are pulling a profit.

    Leave those foolish marxist pseudo-revelations fantasies behind and embrace the ideology of the MAXIMISATION OF VOLUNTARY CAPITAL ACCUMULATION.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 2:35 pm

  146. Hey Graeme
    Since you don’t check your email much, I thought I’d mention here that I’m about to send an email to you via my Yahoo as you said you had trouble contacting me on the other one. Just use that one next time if you want to contact me about future boozing.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 3:54 pm

  147. PS I hope you’ve returned poor Mr Barnes his money!!

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 3:55 pm

  148. “And the private sector wouldn’t likely go for this JIVE if it were a free country and a free market.”

    Actually the same goes for my job, Graeme. A lot (not all) of what we do involves preemptively or ex post defending companies from bad regulation or ensuring that regulations are designed with economic efficiency in mind if they must be introduced. There wouldn’t be a demand for a lot of what we do if the regulatory state didn’t exist or if all regulations were efficient. And don’t forget Rafe is a taxeater too by your definition.

    The regulatory State affects us all, Graeme, not just academics. There’s no getting away from it. It implicates everyone in its web.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 4:00 pm

  149. Yes but these are things that ‘seen and unseen’.

    Who is it that talked about things seen and unseen?

    Was it Bastiat? or the Great Turgot?

    We need all your services but the slant will be different. Because the whole environment will be different and the resources released will be bountious.

    The rate of capital accumulation and capital turnover will be greater.

    So that we will need all your analytical skills in the free market. And you will not lose your capacity to work in these areas in the free market.

    But you may lose your capacity to earn the big bucks its true.

    You MAY or you MAY NOT.

    But nonetheless I cannot quite see the point you are making.

    Now as I told you “I have many thousands of cozzie-bros, each one bigger and more crazy then the last. And they all argue with eachother and they don’t get along……YET each one has sworn a blood-oath to avenge my death.”

    Whether or not this is true think of matters from one of these cousie-brow YOKELs points of view……….

    Lets look at what you are saying and try and see things from a third party perspective.

    “Actually the same goes for my job, Graeme. A lot (not all) of what we do involves preemptively or ex post defending companies from bad regulation or ensuring that regulations are designed with economic efficiency in mind if they must be introduced. ”

    They DON’T have to be introduced. Or few of them. Or if they DO this is resultant from other depredations and is a sort of band-aid.

    But all these High-IQ-Farm-boys would be cheering.

    Or super-angry. Cheering that some dude actually admitted what you’ve admitted.

    To know that even the private sector has been perverted by the BIG LEACH and now some of our best brains are turned over in mitigation of the leach or in furtherance of the leaches blood-sucking tendencies.

    In competition with eachother as it were, but ultimately not doing a great deal thats useful.

    This would tend to VINDICATE the idea that their (the high-IQ farm-boys) failure to FIT IN to that scene was not necessarily the worst condemnation a fella might suffer.

    “There wouldn’t be a demand for a lot of what we do if the regulatory state didn’t exist or if all regulations were efficient. And don’t forget Rafe is a taxeater too by your definition.”

    This means of course that your efforts would be released for activities productive in the wider scheme of things AND IN THEIR OWN RIGHT.

    Your efforts would be used not for just an inbuilt mitigation of the otherwise rampant blood-sucker run wild.

    In a situation of “FIXED VOLUME OF SPENDING” therefore your efforts…. now in productive (rather then mitigating) endeavours would lead to an increase in the OUTPUT of the economy.

    And therefore in the context of a fixed volume of money and spending we would get a reduction of the price level……. or an increase in the rate of capital accumulation….. Or a spreading of the burden of remaining government depredation.

    I’m just glad Jason that you confessed to all this.

    So is it MORE or LESS urgent to put the tax-free-threshold up sky high and turf all the regulation-makers and other tax-eaters out?

    More or less urgent?

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 4:40 pm

  150. There are obviously gains to be made from reducing ‘gaming’ in the system by cutting the size of government or ensuring it doesn’t expand any further – that was the point of my post on utilitarianism.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 4:52 pm

  151. “You’re calling Kirchner a leftist? You’re nuttier than I thought.”

    Yeah but you reckoned that Nick Gruen was a classical liberal.

    Kirchners full of shit.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Look isn’t this a bit like the libertarians being co-opted by the machine to set up a “loyal-opposition?”

    Not loyal to the COUNTRY or to the taxPAYER (does anyone remember the taxpayer?)

    But a loyal opposition PANTOMIME as permanent opposition to BLOOD-SUCKER-CENTRAL to help BLOOD-SUCKER-CENTRL in its efforts to maximise blood-sucking.

    After all if you get the blood-sucking going to hard you aren’t going to be TAX-MAXIMISING within the time-frame of the average tax-eaters concerns now are you?

    Are you Her Majesties Loyal Opposition?

    But not for our good Queen……….

    But are you BLOOD-SUCKER-CENTRALS loyal opposition?

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 4:59 pm

  152. GB
    Kirch isn’t a leftist. He’s a keynesian but firmly on our side of he fence. He loves fiat money, but he’s ok.

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 5:44 pm

  153. “Yeah but you reckoned that Nick Gruen was a classical liberal”

    OK man, stop crucifying me about Nick Gruen. You’re right, I’m wrong. Gruen is all over the place. Everything is metaphysics to him and everything’s just a ‘dialogue’. The politest speaker gets the kudos so watch yourself if you get a little aggressive like Dawkins – it means everything you say is not worth listening to so you’re excluded from the ‘dialogue’

    http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2006/10/22/terry-eagleton-on-richard-dawkins

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 5:48 pm

  154. He doesn’t understand monetary economics. If he thinks otherwise he ought to show up here and lets see if he doesn’t act like Fyodor.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 5:49 pm

  155. Jason read this:
    There are six Robinson children, all of them home-schooled. Matthew’s older brother Joshua, 18, has pinned to the wall of his room the skin of a cougar that he trapped. His older brother Noah, 22, was the top chemistry graduate applicant to MIT, but chose instead to go to his father’s school, Caltech. He is working for his Ph.D. in chemistry. Noah’s older brother, Zachary, 24, is at Iowa State University studying to be a doctor of veterinary medicine, and also working for a chemistry Ph.D. Bethany, 18, is still at home, and her older sister Arynne, 20, has finished two years of college. On the piano Matthew is still on grade 1B, but his math is going well. He will be only 14 by the time he has finished calculus.

    Robinson went to Caltech and his kids are super smart too. I wouldn’t run this guy down even if he’s a little wreiird. They seem friggin smart family to me.

    You need an SAT of close to 1550 to get to Caltech. That’s seriously smart.

    Also, since when does being friendly with a creationist mean you’re dumb. I’ve seen you use this sort of argument before. Are we getting to the stage now when only non-believers can be considered top scientists??? I hope not.

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 5:52 pm

  156. I’ve withdrawn my comment about Robinson, JC.

    Bethell is alright when he’s writing about economics.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 5:54 pm

  157. “it means everything you say is not worth listening to so you’re excluded from the ‘dialogue’”

    Oh for the sake of Muhhamad-and-whores (beat it prophet. I’m over here with your babes).

    How OLD is Gruen? Isn’t he a little bit too old to be part of this deconstructionist JIVE.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 6:02 pm

  158. “Bethell is alright when he’s writing about economics.”

    Well he’s alright when he’s talking about all things apart from evolution isn’t he?

    And in evolution he just puts the proof bar up high.

    And if you guys think you only KNOW things through deduction he’s RIGHT to put the proof bar up high.

    Because if thats all you know you know shit about evolution.

    I IN CONTRAST say we know things ultimately by using all-the-tools and by intellectual-honesty but ultimately by CONVERGENCE.

    And its only by convergence that evolution leaps to a clear head and shoulders above the other alternatives.

    But should you not share my epistemology its a little bit of a hard ask to be hassling Bethel.

    I would say that Bethel is also superb on non-evolutionary science.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 6:07 pm

  159. By the way.

    I’ve gone to his Access-To-Energy site and I’ve ordered his Access-To-Energy Super Special.

    http://www.accesstoenergy.com/

    I’ve paid the money and everything.

    This is how science ought to be. How cool is this guy. Doing original research from his place in Oregon and saving the world from the wages of Lamberting at the same time.

    Does his own work without recourse to the public tit at all.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 6:17 pm

  160. The Skeptical Inquirer had an interesting review of Bethell’s book. Guaranteed to make genocide man blow another gasket.

    TimLambert

    October 22, 2006 at 9:32 pm

  161. You’re the genocide-man Lambert you MAKE ME WANT TO BUY YOU ROSES (EDIT BY ADMIN – Too vulgar and potentially defamatory).

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 9:36 pm

  162. Already I can see that Chris Mooney is an idiot. Looks like the skeptical enquirer is another rag of great heritage perverted by dumb leftists.

    Its happened all over. Once great outfits infiltrated and made ridiculous by the dumb left.

    You don’t spend a lot of time with the actual SCIENCE do you ya big-fat-dumb-fuck.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 9:40 pm

  163. Nothing could defame that holocaust-denying fucking-idiot.

    Let them have bed-nets is more arrogant then any sheila saying let them eat cake.

    He fucking hates these black people.

    And the white ones too.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 9:42 pm

  164. Graeme
    Bethell’s book on science is absolute SHIIITE. If you don’t think so, you’re being totally partisan.

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 9:48 pm

  165. No its not.

    Its you thats talking Shiite.

    Only his evolution stuff is suspect as you would expect.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 9:49 pm

  166. There is just no content to the Chris Mooney peice at all. There is the false charge that there is an anti-science movement coming from the right.

    Thats bullshit. If there is an anti-science movement it would have to be the global warming panic.

    Mooney is just like fatty-Lambert. Casts aspersions but there is not content to it.

    Its one of the most pathetic bits of writing imagineable this Chris Mooney screed. Can you see a single solid argument there?

    And that there is no argument there rather speaks well for Bethell I would have thought.

    You must go a great deal on antiquated brand-names Jason.

    You ought not think that the Skeptical Enquirer is at the level it was back in the 70’s.

    GMB

    October 22, 2006 at 9:54 pm

  167. Point of order, Graeme. You keep saying ‘dumb left’. Does that mean there IS a ‘smart left’? Or is the ‘dumb’ redundant under your worldview?

    Jason Soon

    October 22, 2006 at 10:13 pm

  168. Actually I have to take issue with this. Mooney is saying that there is a right wing hit job on science. I agree there are some parts of the right that have a problem with such things as evolution and areas of genetic research.

    Meanwhile Mooney ignores the fact that the left only believes in about half of evolution anyway. The most important part that deals with heritable human genetics is placed in the closet and locked up. Let’s not forget that Larry Summers lost his job at the most prestigious university in the world because he even mentioned gender differences at a conference!!!!

    Lets also look at what the green left has done by virtually locking up important Alaskan oil finds because a tiny area ( 2,500 acres in all of Alaska) would be used to extract oil . According to these liars it could “ruin” a pristine wilderness. ANWA would add 1 million barrels to US domestic oil production. Let’s also remind ourselves that the US has a 90-mile limit on offshore drilling in case it may upset the “pristine” seabed inside the continental shelf. The US could very well be oil independent if domestic drilling and exploration was opened up.

    Oh and I almost forgot the local stuff. Sydney and Melbourne are virtually dying of thirst because of the labor state governments are beholden to the green vote and have nixed nay chance we may have had of building another damn because of the “importance” of fresh water running into the sea.

    Mooney is simply mendacious if he actually wants people to think the GOP is fighting science. He ought to look at his side of the political fence.

    Lets do a tally and see which side has been more damaging.

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 11:12 pm

  169. In fact lets ask Mooney the following questions:

    1. Does Mooney believe there are inherently racial differences?
    2. Does Mooney believe there are gender differences and was Larry Summers correct in his speech noting these differences.
    3. Does Mooney believe there exists the strongest possibility that there is an inheritable IQ difference between different races?
    4. Does Mooney believe that 2,500 acres of Alaskan wildness to be used for oil production would actually cause the demise of the Alaskan wilderness as many green groups and the Democrat party Claim?
    5.Does Mooney agree that imposing a 90 mile restriction in oil exploration “saves” seabed from exploitation?

    Oil exploration is these areas is part of applied technological science that cannot be overlooked. BHP recently drilled 1.2 miles down in the gulf of Mexico which took great engineering talent to achieve. This also science.

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 11:26 pm

  170. These are Chris Mooney’s credentials:

    Chris was born in Mesa, Arizona, and grew up in New Orleans, Louisiana; he graduated from Yale University with a B.A. in English in 1999. Before becoming a freelancer, Chris worked for two years at The American Prospect as a writing fellow, then staff writer, then online editor (where he helped to create the popular blog Tapped).
    Chris has contributed to a variety of other publications in recent years, including Slate, Salon, Mother Jones, Legal Affairs, Reason, The American Scholar, The Washington Monthly, The Utne Reader, Columbia Journalism Review, The Washington Post, The Washington City Paper, and The Boston Globe

    It’s regrettable that Chris seems to only have an undergrad BA English from Yale, which is fine in itself, but it hardly speaks of any science orientation or even go close to making him a science expert.
    Although I commend Chris writing for Reason Magazine, a truly wonderful libertarian e-zine, every other publication has a clearly defined left of centre bias. No problem with that but lets not kid ourselves that someone writing for Mother Jones, Columbia Journalism Review, Sate and Solon doesn’t carry bags as an ideological hack. In fact every publication listed here has a defined left of centre bent. This would make me suspicious of Chris’s motivations in anything he writes in a New York minute. Again, no problem with him doing his schtik but lets not pretend this guy is down the middle.

    jc

    October 22, 2006 at 11:41 pm

  171. In fact every publication listed here has a defined left of centre bent.

    Of course, Reason isn’t. Sorry.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 12:23 am

  172. I’m not sure why I’m all of a sudden the designated hitman for the Australian right all of a sudden. It seems lately every time the word fight is mentioned I’m matched up against a different leftist.

    That said, colour me a Karate skeptic. I’m sure John would beat me in a karate match but I think my 40 kilos and 30cm over him would probably see me over the line if it was no-holds-barred.

    yobbo

    October 23, 2006 at 3:00 am

  173. “Point of order, Graeme. You keep saying ‘dumb left’. Does that mean there IS a ’smart left’? Or is the ‘dumb’ redundant under your worldview?”

    They are pretty hard to find. They would be apolitical types who have had specialties away from politics and have more or less inherited their views.

    But what is your ridiculous bigotry about Bethel?

    This is just craziness on your part. Putting evolution aside one cannot find a commentator with a surer hand on the subject.

    Mooney knows nothing about science or he revealed no knowledge in this writing. Why take the idiot into account in the first place. May as well have been fatty-Lambert. Genocide-promoter and holocaust-denier.

    But Bethels always got a marvellous handle on these things. If you want to get good science commentary it is precisely to Bethel you want to go.

    This goes back to your predjudicing the status quo IN ERROR and to an antt-Christian bias.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 3:25 am

  174. “And sure enough, there’s plenty of science hijacking in The Politically Incorrect Guide to Science. Take the chapter on global warming. The excellent science and statistics blogger Tim Lambert has proposed a game called “global warming skeptic bingo,” in which all of the various discredited arguments that are repeatedly used to undermine the consensus view of human-caused climate change are arranged in a series of squares. ”

    I mean look at that? Mooney’s clearly an idiot. If he had any sort of handle on science at all he’d realise that Fatty-Lambert the genoocide-promoter was a total fraud when it came to science.

    Bethel…………. Great science commentator

    Lambert………. holocaust-denier.

    Mooney cannot even get that right.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 3:31 am

  175. Jason:
    >PS I hope you’ve returned poor Mr Barnes his money!!

    The Birdman is not even returning my emails at this point…;-) However, we will see what the week brings.

    Daniel Barnes

    October 23, 2006 at 6:20 am

  176. 82. Jason Soon | October 21st, 2006 at 4:38 pm
    sorry to report this Fyodor but we lost our last few months’ content (from when we moved over to this domain). the earlier Thread of Doom is still safe in backup but c8to isn’t going to put everything back until he knows our current arrangements are stabilised.

    You fecking WHAT?

    Jaysus, Jase.

    Fyodor

    October 23, 2006 at 8:10 am

  177. 83. jc | October 21st, 2006 at 4:42 pm
    “FTR, I like italic and Italians. In general, natch.”

    Not so sure about that, Fyador.

    1.You were giggling hysterically when your friend Munnchkin stole my identity and wrote those racist comments about me.
    2.You were egging Munnchkin on at the Troppo site when you thought he had posted under my name
    3 You acccused Jack S of having the racial characteristics of a coward.

    FTR, I think you do have racist tendencies from the above.
    As I said, you can feel free anytime to call me a coward to my face becasue of my race and we’ll flip a coin and see who’s resting on a hospital bed on a drip feed for the next 6 months.

    Maybe you amy want to apologise to Jack S for saying what you did.

    Interesting perspective you have Fyador. You bascially attack people’s concern with Muslims no matter how nebulous, yet we have the above.

    Interesting perspective YOU have, JC. None of your three assertions have any proof whatsoever. If you’re going to revert to ad hominem abuse, at least make an attempt at substantiating your turgid lies.

    Seeing as you’re now accusing me of being a racist, the following question seems redundant, but I like to do these things properly: are you reneguing on our agreement? You’ve clearly crossed the line already, but I want it to be clear you broke the agreement.

    Fyodor

    October 23, 2006 at 8:29 am

  178. “Interesting perspective YOU have, JC.”

    Not really. Just par for the course.

    “None of your three assertions have any proof whatsoever.”

    The reason we have courts is that we’ll let other people judge for the obvious reason that you are unqualified to do so.

    “If you’re going to revert to ad hominem abuse, at least make an attempt at substantiating your turgid lies.”

    I did.

    “Seeing as you’re now accusing me of being a racist, the following question seems redundant, but I like to do these things properly: are you reneguing on our agreement?”

    What I think you ought to do is apolgize to Jack S and beg his forgiveness. That’s what I think you ought to do. That’s if you’re serious about this.

    “You’ve clearly crossed the line already, but I want it to be clear you broke the agreement.”

    I’m not breaking any agreement. I saw that Jack recently wrote about this and I added those racist comments to what you have said about me. Asking you to account for racism is not breaking any agreement.

    I’m serious. If you and “Munny” as you called him (when you thought he as stealing my identity) want to call me a coward etc etc etc to my face, go ahead. I’ll be happy to supply all the details where you can do this. Bring an ambulance though. I’m serious.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:47 am

  179. For the love of Christ, Hayek and Friedman, Birdy, GIVE BARNESY HIS MONEY BACK or I’m shunning you like a Dalit.

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 10:50 am

  180. Victorian Liberal party policy – free bus rides for students

    http://andrewlanderyou.blogspot.com/2006/10/free-spender-is-red-ted-taking.html

    Brilliant!

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 11:26 am

  181. JC, aren’t you and Jackson in the Liberal party in Victoria? Try and kick some sense into those idiots, will you?

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 11:31 am

  182. Jason.

    They are a lost cause at the state level. It will be 12 yeaes before they turn this ship round. The only ay they cvould get in before hand is if we have another one of those humdinger recessions like we had in the early 90’s.

    Recall, I warned you from the beginning what a useless establishment lefty the new guy is.

    I joining the libertarian party anyway. So I’ll let that other membership lapse.This gal may not be the prettiest gal at the party but she sure isn’t going to go down the back alley and make out with the next good looking guy she sees behind my back.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 11:38 am

  183. Jason.

    They are a lost cause at the state level. It will be 12 years before they turn this ship round. The only way they could get in before hand is if we have another one of those humdinger recessions like we had in the early 90’s.

    Recall, I warned you from the beginning what a useless establishment lefty the new guy is.

    I joining the libertarian party anyway. So I’ll let that other membership lapse.This gal may not be the prettiest gal at the party but she sure isn’t going to go down the back alley and make out with the next good looking guy she sees behind my back.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 11:40 am

  184. It’s truly and amazing thing to watch. The grassroots of the party is more economically liberal than the representation.
    Years of having Kroger, Walker and the rest of the gaggle a the top or pulling the strings has caused this fish to rot from the head down.

    I actually think the libertarian party could make some serious inroads in the country if things are properly handled and it would make the libs sit up and take notice.

    10% of the US population sees itself supporting libertarian party principles. I would say that kind of support ( may be a little less) could be found at liberal party grass roots. It’s the only way to get these bastards to notice when we have compulsory voting.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 11:47 am

  185. Yobbo: ‘I’m not sure why I’m all of a sudden the designated hitman for the Australian right all of a sudden. It seems lately every time the word fight is mentioned I’m matched up against a different leftist”

    This is why, Yobbo:
    http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/10/13/confusing-marx-stalin/#comment-166018

    Eric: The problem with your revolutionary wet dream is that us oppressive capitalist overlords have all the guns. What are you lefties going to fight with? Tofu sticks? Giant Papier Mache effigies?

    I actually hope you start this revolution sooner rather than later. Shooting you would certainly be a lot easier than trying to talk sense into you.

    FMD that’s four people you’ve agreed to take on already Yobbo – Don Arthur, Chris Lloyd, John Quiggin and Eric Blair…

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 1:55 pm

  186. 181. jc | October 23rd, 2006 at 10:47 am

    “Interesting perspective YOU have, JC.”

    Not really. Just par for the course.

    What, falsely accusing people of racism is “par for the course”? What course are we playing on, exactly – Ad Hominem Hills?

    “None of your three assertions have any proof whatsoever.”

    The reason we have courts is that we’ll let other people judge for the obvious reason that you are unqualified to do so.

    Is that right? We have courts so that JC can avoid backing up his lies on blogs? I think not.

    “If you’re going to revert to ad hominem abuse, at least make an attempt at substantiating your turgid lies.”

    I did.

    Really? Where? I don’t see a single quote or link. You’ve substantiated nothing.

    “Seeing as you’re now accusing me of being a racist, the following question seems redundant, but I like to do these things properly: are you reneguing on our agreement?”

    What I think you ought to do is apolgize to Jack S and beg his forgiveness. That’s what I think you ought to do. That’s if you’re serious about this.

    Jack Strocchi has fuck all to do with you accusing me of being racist. What you think I ought to do is of no interest to me.

    “You’ve clearly crossed the line already, but I want it to be clear you broke the agreement.”

    I’m not breaking any agreement. I saw that Jack recently wrote about this and I added those racist comments to what you have said about me. Asking you to account for racism is not breaking any agreement.

    Accusing me of racism is simple ad hominem. You said “FTR, I think you do have racist tendencies from the above.”

    Regardless of whether you can substantiate that accusation or not (and you haven’t, and can’t), that is an insulting ad hominem statement. If you don’t retract it, our agreement is void, by your hand.

    I’m serious. If you and “Munny” as you called him (when you thought he as stealing my identity) want to call me a coward etc etc etc to my face, go ahead. I’ll be happy to supply all the details where you can do this. Bring an ambulance though. I’m serious.

    Yes, I can tell you’re serious by the way you said it twice. You must be really, really serious.

    If you have a problem with Munny’s behaviour, I suggest you take it up with him – it’s nothing to do with me. I’m not acting in concert with the guy, and nor do I endorse his racist comments, as I’ve now made clear several times.

    As for the ambulance et cetera, I’ve already told you I don’t care about your bravado fantasies – tell someone who gives a shit.

    Fyodor

    October 23, 2006 at 2:37 pm

  187. Interesting perspective YOU have, JC.”

    Not really. Just par for the course.

    What, falsely accusing people of racism is “par for the course”? What course are we playing on, exactly – Ad Hominem Hills?

    It’s not a false accusation. It’s a real one after reading what you said about Jack S. Par for the course means you have met my low expectations of you again.

    “Is that right? We have courts so that JC can avoid backing up his lies on blogs? I think not.

    “If you’re going to revert to ad hominem abuse, at least make an attempt at substantiating your turgid lies.”

    I did.

    Really? Where? I don’t see a single quote or link. You’ve substantiated nothing.”

    I have. And I did. What’s turgid is what you have been doing.,

    “Jack Strocchi has fuck all to do with you accusing me of being racist. What you think I ought to do is of no interest to me”

    Jack S has fuck everything to do with it when seen in context of what you said about him.

    Accusing me of racism is simple ad hominem. You said “FTR, I think you do have racist tendencies from the above.”

    “Regardless of whether you can substantiate that accusation or not (and you haven’t, and can’t), that is an insulting ad hominem statement. If you don’t retract it, our agreement is void, by your hand.”

    No. I have’t voided anything. but feel free to insinuate, giggle or make racist comments about me again. As i said, you only seem happy to do it from afar, but not to my face. I guess voiding the agreement to you would mean that you would continue to egg on “Mummy” as you affectionately refer to him. Nce touch. Or maybe it means coming out with new racist things to say you didn’t have enough time to try on Jack S.

    “If you have a problem with Munny’s behaviour, I suggest you take it up with him – it’s nothing to do with me. I’m not acting in concert with the guy, and nor do I endorse his racist comments, as I’ve now made clear several times.”

    Where did I say you were acting in concert with the guy? Another lie.

    “As for the ambulance et cetera, I’ve already told you I don’t care about your bravado fantasies – tell someone who gives a shit.”

    You mean calling me a coward because of my race to my face. As I said, the offer stands for you to do it any time in my presence. I’ll just excrow the medical bills that will come my way from the inevitable law suit.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 3:00 pm

  188. “FMD that’s four people you’ve agreed to take on already Yobbo – Don Arthur, Chris Lloyd, John Quiggin and Eric Blair… ”

    i’d pay money to ref this one. I still put my money on Yobbo.

    Strcitly speaking Yobbs never threatened Eric the tax-eating slob with a fight. He threatened to shoot him if he wants to start a revolution. Not the same thing.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 3:06 pm

  189. I nominate Edwards as a stand in if Yobbo goes down. After all, he is taking on 4.

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 3:08 pm

  190. Eriic Blair wants to start a revolution because there are too many cereal choices at the super market. True. He wants cereal choice to be voted by democratic means. He even embarrasses the LP team with his rank stupidy. This guy is an academic. let me guess the soft sciences again. Close it down. Close the whole thing down.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 3:10 pm

  191. 190. jc | October 23rd, 2006 at 3:00 pm
    “Interesting perspective YOU have, JC.”

    Not really. Just par for the course.

    “What, falsely accusing people of racism is “par for the course”? What course are we playing on, exactly – Ad Hominem Hills?”

    It’s not a false accusation. It’s a real one after reading what you said about Jack S. Par for the course means you have met my low expectations of you again.

    Reading where, JC? You’ve yet to substantiate any of your lies. Making up shit doesn’t count, you know.

    “Is that right? We have courts so that JC can avoid backing up his lies on blogs? I think not.

    If you’re going to revert to ad hominem abuse, at least make an attempt at substantiating your turgid lies.”

    I did.

    “Really? Where? I don’t see a single quote or link. You’ve substantiated nothing.”

    I have. And I did. What’s turgid is what you have been doing.

    Nope. Still got nothing. No surprise there.

    “Jack Strocchi has fuck all to do with you accusing me of being racist. What you think I ought to do is of no interest to me”

    Jack S has fuck everything to do with it when seen in context of what you said about him.

    “Accusing me of racism is simple ad hominem. You said “FTR, I think you do have racist tendencies from the above.”

    Regardless of whether you can substantiate that accusation or not (and you haven’t, and can’t), that is an insulting ad hominem statement. If you don’t retract it, our agreement is void, by your hand.”

    No. I have’t voided anything. but feel free to insinuate, giggle or make racist comments about me again. As i said, you only seem happy to do it from afar, but not to my face. I guess voiding the agreement to you would mean that you would continue to egg on “Mummy” as you affectionately refer to him. Nce touch. Or maybe it means coming out with new racist things to say you didn’t have enough time to try on Jack S.

    So be it. You’ve refused to retract your ad hominem remark and thus the agreement is over.

    “If you have a problem with Munny’s behaviour, I suggest you take it up with him – it’s nothing to do with me. I’m not acting in concert with the guy, and nor do I endorse his racist comments, as I’ve now made clear several times.”

    Where did I say you were acting in concert with the guy? Another lie.

    Does the following look familiar, moron?

    “If you and Munny as you called him (when you thought he as stealing my identity) want to call me a coward etc etc etc to my face, go ahead.”

    Try to keep up with your own arguments at least. I know you struggle to follow any kind of argument, but put some effort in, you lazy clown.

    “As for the ambulance et cetera, I’ve already told you I don’t care about your bravado fantasies – tell someone who gives a shit.”

    You mean calling me a coward because of my race to my face. As I said, the offer stands for you to do it any time in my presence. I’ll just excrow the medical bills that will come my way from the inevitable law suit.

    I don’t give a fuck about your race or your persecution complex. And in the highly unlikely event I ever feel inclined to beat up a pensioner I’ll remember your offer. In the meantime, I suggest you take your blustering bullshit elsewhere. Perhaps you can find a slobbering halfwit to take you seriously. I don’t.

    Fyodor

    October 23, 2006 at 5:12 pm

  192. You forgot the sniggering racial stuff that goes with it , you pathetic little pantsy.

    Hiding behind a moniker and dishing out racist stuff to Jack S and then sniggering and later demanding Jason keeps it on a thread is not my idea of a fully grown man.

    What’s funny is that you are now trying to deny it. I notice your “deniability” couldn’t quite crack it with Jack S though.

    You were dying for the agreement to fall over were’nt you, you turgid little racist. It must be hard to avoid it racist abuse. Was it dinner convsation at home?

    At least you’re selective. You obviously hate Italians as you have proved by siding with “Munny” ( how sweet) and calling Jack S a coward becasue of his race. But I can’t get your love of islamic terrorists you’re constantly sideing with. You need to explain that one, Fyador. Is it some sort of sexualized kick you get out of seeing another dead westerner from a suicide bomber?

    But go ahead, start your rants of racist abuse and join Munny in the sewer where you belong. I won’t be joining you though, you turgid little pantsy.

    Oh, and I am not that old.

    Two offers. I am sure Jackson would be happy to debate you on his site if you asked kindly, however he would much prefer to do so with someone who isn’t a racist lying creep that hides behind a moniker while doing so.

    My standing offer apllies. No bravado. Certainly not like time time you offered to do the same with Jack S. Anytime you want to call me a coward in my face becasue of my race ,your most welcome to do so, you patehtic lying little creep. I won’t hold my breath though.

    Oooo, I can’t wait for the next witty comments to flyoff that keyboard of yours.

    Do youself a favor. You offer nothing to this site other than flame wars 100% of the time. Why don’t you simply run off with that other pantsy mate of yours, vapid nabs, and don’t come back.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 5:35 pm

  193. “Two offers. I am sure Jackson would be happy to debate you on his site if you asked kindly, however he would much prefer to do so with someone who isn’t a racist lying creep that hides behind a moniker while doing so.”

    Come on JC.

    You cannot mean what you are saying?

    You don’t want our best economist to get down in the dirt, with Fyodor, while Fyodor is lying so much in his confusing way that people cannot tell the difference between this lunatic and Jackson?

    Do you?

    Instead it would be better to get Jackson to agree to come on after Fyodor is banned. We’d likely break new ground then. Although Jacksons probably got better things to do.

    The worst thing is the way Fyodor never will allow ONE ASPECT to be resolved entirely. Instead he just leaves all this dishonesty all over the place for others to clean up.

    I mean this is a pretty simple thesis that Gerrard Jackson was putting over.

    I’ve been trying to explain this to people for MONTHS and TENS OF THOUSANDS OF WORDS.

    Its simple. Its obvious. And it isn’t even too hard to understand.

    How come no-one understands it yet?

    In a word: FYODOR.

    Of course all the other participants with the exception of you have acted atrociously and unscientifically as well.

    But Fyodor allowed them to do so. Because people are idiots when it comes to money. So all you need is one Fyodor and the rest of them can’t help themselves.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 6:07 pm

  194. Actually, Birdy, Fyodor’s comments are clear, sensible and illuminating.

    You and JC are like Watson – There to ask stupid questions so that Holmes can explain it for the benefit of the slower readers.

    Thankyou, Fyodor, for educational services rendered to the Australian blogosphere.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 6:25 pm

  195. No they are not.

    You are lying.

    And you are clearly a dumb-leftist.

    Folks this is what I was talking about. Fyodor enables idiots to hide behind him.

    Refute anything I’ve said about ANYTHING using your own words SHIT FOR BRAINS.

    Another dead shit commie-witch-hunter….

    (take him out the back and shoot him.)

    My God what a fuckwit and fucking lying idiot.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:20 pm

  196. Who is this lying JohnZ idiot?

    I don’t believe I’ve so much as NOTICED his simple dishonest mind before.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:24 pm

  197. You chickened out of our bet about a week ago, Birdy.

    Brrrrk buk buk buk.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 7:28 pm

  198. Fucking hell Birdy I hope you have given Barnsy his money back, otherwise we’re calling you a thief.

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 7:30 pm

  199. And Birdy, the reason I’m not going to argue about this is because you’re so ideological that you never change your mind.
    You just march lock-step with Rothbard and other fever-swamp Austrians while screaming abuse at anyone who disagrees.

    Fyodor, on the otherhand writes clearly and non-ideologically. His points are well researched and tell of years of thinking about these issues and working in banking.
    If you ever find the honesty to admit that he’s right, I suggest you send him a thankyou note and perhaps some chocolates for his patience in explaining basic economics to an amatuer like yourself.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 7:36 pm

  200. Oh this fucking lying cocksucker.

    YOU CHICKENED OUT OF THE BET YOU LYING FUCK.

    The bet is still on and you are still chickening out as we speak.

    What a fucking wanker you are.

    This fellow hasn’t said one damn thing tonight that hasn’t been a filthy lie.

    I’m starting to resent JC taking me by surprise and stopping me from using the c-word.

    WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU JASON?

    Is people LYING ALL THE TIME…. do you have NO AVERSION TO THIS WHATSOEVER?????

    Surely its not too much for you to have a NO LIARS POLICY?

    I don’t think thats too much to ask.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:36 pm

  201. “And Birdy, the reason I’m not going to argue about this is because you’re so ideological that you never change your mind.”

    A FUCKIN FILTHY FUCKING LIE AND LEFTIST PROJECTION.

    I always update. You fucking have so many fucking retractions to make you make me want to puke…… on you.

    “You just march lock-step with Rothbard and other fever-swamp Austrians while screaming abuse at anyone who disagrees.”

    A fucking filthy lie

    “Fyodor, on the otherhand writes clearly and non-ideologically. His points are well researched and tell of years of thinking about these issues and working in banking.”:

    More lies. Fyodor lies all the time. As Gerrard and JC now know.

    “If you ever find the honesty to admit that he’s right, I suggest you send him a thankyou note and perhaps some chocolates for his patience in explaining basic economics to an amatuer like yourself.”

    He’s not right. He’s a fucking leftist lying asshole like you.

    You lying bastard.

    Now where is my money. And where are those retractions about Drudge.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:39 pm

  202. Lets see those retractions about Drudge you fucking lying filth.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:40 pm

  203. Have you given Barnes back his money?

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 7:41 pm

  204. “Actually, Birdy, Fyodor?s comments are clear, sensible and illuminating.”

    What a fucking lying asshole.

    You bastard.

    And there you are lying to your mates and pretending to be a libertarian.

    You are not a libertarian mate.

    You are a %%%%

    [EDIT BY ADMIN – have you given Barnes back his money?]

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:42 pm

  205. “Have you given Barnes back his money?”

    Thats between me and the honourable Barnes.

    You have VERY bad instincts man.

    You should be coming down on this filthy lying idiot that will not debate but hides behind that bipolar lying fuckwit Fyodor.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:44 pm

  206. JohnZ:

    1 .Fyador calls Munn -a sordid racist- “Munny” in the sweetest almost romantic that can be expected from someone who’s in love.

    2 Fyador expressed regret to see some of the most atrocious speech I’ve seen on the net when “Munny” was attacking my racial background. He was angry that Jason had removed the filth from the site saying it was breech of free speech.

    3. Fydador mistakenly took me for his sweet heart, Munny at Troppo recently and thought it was a great joke that “Munny” (that’s how Fyador refers to that racist) could have been stealing my identity again.

    4 You have also spoken out against “Munny’s” racism. If I recall correctly, you seemed to recoil from it.

    5.Fyador got into a scrape with Jack Strocchi and called him a coward making an obvious reference to his race.

    6 The only thing I have done is suggest Fyador is a racist creep and would like to see how brave he is by saying the Jack S comment to my face instead of hiding behind a moniker behind a moniker.

    What’s interesting is the shocking liar’s hypocritical attitude. He goes round doing hit jobs on people like CL and Jack because he doesn’t like the way they show concern about Islamic thugs. Fyador is sentimental that way. He’s minority rights kind of guy. According to Fyador it seems there are too many concerned right-wingers and not enough suicide bombers. So “Munny” gets a kiss on the backside for displaying shocking racism but someone like CL is a horrible human being.
    He has also given me a hard time for sticking up for Bird in the past. Meanwhile a shocking thieving racist is referred to as ” Munny”.
    So instead of offering your indignant swill, maybe you ought to just remain silent when you don’t have all the information or are simply too stupid to figure it out.
    Anytime I see this racist prick giving someone a hard time he’s going to be reminded of his vulgar support of “Munny”. Those are the kind of ethics you’re supporting, JohnZ. Be proud. I’ll remind you too next time you are feigning some kind of horror at a target.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 7:47 pm

  207. Birdy, I take back what I said about you being Watson. He, at least, was an amiable fellow.

    Birdy – You’re awfully sensitive when it comes to comparisons between yourself and Fyodor. Could it be a touch of the green eyed monster?
    I think you’re experiencing that quintessentially LEFTIST trait – ENVY.

    As for “your money”, it’s still with c8to. If can find the time to write a substantive post (other than abuse) which outlines the terms of the bet, and transfer $150 to the escrow then the bet will be on.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 7:49 pm

  208. GMB
    This is a very good friend of c8to’s you’re talking about. Better watch what you say.

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 7:49 pm

  209. Actually John, I kind sick of your accusations towards Bird.

    Let me understand something. Did you agree to the terms of the bet before you placed the money with C8to? Did you or not?

    If you did show us. Because if you didn’t agree to the terms and you put your money out with C8to there’s no bet. So what is it.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 7:52 pm

  210. You are a fuckwit John.

    And if you weren’t lying you would have actually pointed out something I was getting wrong.

    Which shows what a filthy fucking coward you are.

    What a fucking liar.

    Hiding behind Fyodor.

    Actualy it must be said that THATS a bit of a habit around here.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:53 pm

  211. Oh Ho HO …

    Now the asshole is pretending he hasn’t backed out.

    He dissapears and comes back with a new name… And he reckons it HIM that hasn’t weazled out…

    The fact is he never weazled IN.

    Never intended to make a serious bet. Never intended to pay up.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:55 pm

  212. “GMB
    This is a very good friend of c8to’s you’re talking about. Better watch what you say.”

    He aint no friend of anyone.

    A liar and a coward is no friend.

    Friends are an asset.

    He’s a liability.

    You are having trouble with your accounting.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 7:57 pm

  213. “If can find the time to write a substantive post (other than abuse) which outlines the terms of the bet, and transfer $150 to the escrow then the bet will be on.”

    Oh. I got it now. I hadn’t really followed the bet closely because you were boring me with the bird sounds.

    So there was never nay bet because you didn’t agree the terms. is that right? Then what a frigging no hoper you are. what a loser to put everyone through that briong shit when there was no bet. How friggin dishonest can someone be…. all th se birds sounds etc…… You couldn’t agree to the bet and he’s the bad guy.
    Fm. You lefties are simply getting worse by the day.

    Stop pretending you’re libertarian. Your not. Just get out of the political closet and come out. Scream it out… “I’m a lefty and proud of it”. C8to won’t hate you. He’ll still like you.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 7:59 pm

  214. Jc, Bird refused to even discuss the terms until I transferred the money as a sign of good faith.

    Responding to his goading, I transferred the money to the escrow, letting him know on 4 separate occaisions that for the bet to go ahead he would have to escrow the money as well.

    After c8to confirmed that he had it, he refused to escrow the money himself, implicitly calling me and c8to thieves. Finally, after a week, he started discussing terms but predictably tried to change the bet. The server crashed and we haven’t heard a peep about it since.

    I fully understand loyalty to friends, JC, but at some point you’re giong to have to call a spade a spade.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:00 pm

  215. Oh, and brrrrk buk buk buk BUKAAAK!

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:01 pm

  216. Graeme
    I’m assuming you’re doing something to return Barnes’ money. I’ll let up for now. If he comes back here saying that you haven’t we’re going to have to start holding you to account.

    Daniel – if you’re reading, tell us when Birdy has returned your money.

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 8:02 pm

  217. “Finally, after a week, he started discussing terms but predictably tried to change the bet. ”

    Change the bet FROM WHAT you fucking liar….

    Like I’d agreed on the bet.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:03 pm

  218. “but at some point you’re giong to have to call a spade a spade.”

    Or a chicken a chicken.

    Cozzie bro, why are you letting down the family name like this? A coward AND a thief? Will I have to start making chicken noises at the next reunion?

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 23, 2006 at 8:05 pm

  219. John Z

    you missed the other comments about Fyador. Want to defend him again while referring to what i said.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:06 pm

  220. Jc: Obviously he would only be obliged to transfer the money after we agreed on conditions but he was refusing to do it outright… Even though we were using a mutually trusted escrow. Can you see the hypocrisy here, JC? Yes or no?

    Change the bet FROM WHAT you fucking liar….

    From whether Gore said smoking causes global warming to whether or not Drudge retracted stories.

    Ok, Bird, you’ve got one last chance to make this happen. State your conditions clearly and I’ll tell you if they’re acceptable.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:09 pm

  221. cozzie bro, we’re brawlers, not cowards.
    Clean up this palarver and give your fellow Kiwi Barnes back his money while you’re at it.

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 23, 2006 at 8:11 pm

  222. What happened is that this asshole made all these accusations… never once came up with any evidence… and then in lieu of his lack of evidence proposed that we have a bet….

    It was just about the time that you would have expected any normal human to make a retraction or to admit they had no evidence for the slanders they were re-parroting from their leftist sources.

    So I thought and said from the start that he wasn’t serious about the bet. That he was full of shit. And that he would have to put up the money AND I WASN’T GOING TO.

    Because he was full of shit. And should have retracted.

    Now I said I WASN’T GOING TO AND I SAID IT AND I MEANT IT AND I WASN’T BACKING DOWN TO THE SWARMING TAUNTING.

    I wasn’t going to let him think that this bet constituted any sort of excuse for him not making the retraction.

    It must be understood that ever Anna had come on and recognised that I had won the debate hands down and with all due overkill and I STILL could not get this liar to own up to that really obvious fact.

    And so right from the start I made it clear. That I’d go with a bet. That this bet of his was crap and a Lambert-like substitute for evidence… AND THAT I WASN’T PUTTING THE MONEY UP.

    And I stuck to that but then called for C8tos bank account when he finally came up with a bet that was still ridiculous… but wasn’t AS ridiculous as before.

    He’s a fucking idiot.

    But then again he was helped out by typically perverse behaviour by people we tend to hold out some hope for.

    Jason ALSO made accusations against Drudge… would not back them up… would not participate in the bet… and spent all his time building up the dishonest guy.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:12 pm

  223. John
    Do you understand the rules of betting. There is not bet until the terms are agreed. Anyone can walk away from a bet before that( obviously before they shake) for any reason they like. it doesn’t mean you were right because the other person didn’t go ahead. It can be a 1 million things.

    Not for one moment am I associating this comment with Birdy… but someone could have been short of food money for thr wek because unexpected expenses came up. A normal person wouldn’t make the bet in this cricumstance.

    That’s why unless the terms are agreed and the the deal is shaken there is not bet and the person who walks away has a certain right not to be fucking hounded.

    If you don’t understand what a contract is how the fuck do you call yourself a libertarian. You’re a lefty because only lefties and idiots don’t understand contracts and terms..

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:15 pm

  224. Jc: My comments were about his behaviour on the banking thread which has been funny, intelligent, patient beyond belief and very
    enlightening. A class act all round.

    I would stand by my comments even if he were a member of the KKK. It is irrelevent to his outstanding performance on the thread of doom.

    However, since I think you’re lying, link to a racist commenthe made and I’ll call him on it.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:16 pm

  225. “Jc: Obviously he would only be obliged to transfer the money after we agreed on conditions but he was refusing to do it outright”

    Thats a lie for starters.

    But I made it clear to you. You had acted like such an asshole. And you hadn’t retracted your baseless slanders.

    You had not a scratch of evidence.

    And you should have fucking retracted you fucking asshole.

    So I’m not entering bets on some sort of equal level with assholes who are that far beneath me.

    Why didn’t you just retract you fucking cocksucker?

    I’m not on any sort of HANDSHAKE level with a complete turd like you?

    Who the fuck do you think you are?

    I made it clear that I would take the bet but you were putting up the money first.

    Because liars like you don’t pay up.

    I know assholes like you.

    Did you think for one minute I’d enter a gentlemans wager on some sort of equal footing with you when you were proved wrong and did not retract.

    You are fucking tripping.

    And every step of the way you wimped out of this bet.

    Its not as if I haven’t see this lying fucking bogus wager technique of the lefts put about a bunch of times before….

    That was the understanding I was proceeding on right from the start.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:21 pm

  226. Lets get this right.

    As soon as I request c8tos account number (fucking reluctantly I might add) this fuckwit dissapears and then comes back under another name.

    Yet he projected this onto ME??????!!!!!

    I haven’t missed a DAY from this forum.

    See he’s fucking lying.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:22 pm

  227. Why do you think I am lying? Where do you think i am lying?

    What did I say above you disagree with. Ask Jack if the comment was racist.

    Ask Fyador if he refers to Mumm as “Munny” -an obvious pat on the shoulder for his behavior.

    I notice you have nothing to say about the post I madeJ ust other side issues.
    Is there anything in the post you disagree with or I think I lied about, john?
    Prove I’m lying or take it back.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:23 pm

  228. JC, You are correct that there is no bet until terms are agreed upon.

    What do you think of the following behaviour?

    1) Demand, when a bet is proposed, that the counterparty instantly transfer the money to the escrow.
    2) Continuously call the counterparty a thief and refuse to discuss terms until the money is transferred.
    3) Once the escrow has the money, refuse to agree to any conditions that require you to also escrow money.
    4) Refuse to discuss the terms of the bet.
    5) Accuse your opponent of chickening out while all the time refusing to discuss the bet…

    I’ve tried hard to make this bet go ahead, JC. If any of the situations you described above came to pass, he could have just said “I want to bet less” or “I don’t want to bet”.
    Instead of levelling with us, he chose to continue to insult me.

    This is why he’s a coward.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:25 pm

  229. “Anyone can walk away from a bet before that( obviously before they shake) for any reason they like. it doesn’t mean you were right because the other person didn’t go ahead. It can be a 1 million things.”

    Its WORSE then that.

    I never walked away from it. It was always HIM walking away from the bet and trying to pretend it was me.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:26 pm

  230. It is easy to prove you are not lying, JC. Just link to the offending comment.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:28 pm

  231. “1) Demand, when a bet is proposed, that the counterparty instantly transfer the money to the escrow.”

    There is one reason for that and one reason for that only.

    ITS BECAUSE YOU ARE AN ASSHOLE.

    And I made it clear that I was betting but you were putting the money up. Because your bet was a fraud from the start and that it was in lieu of evidence for your baseless slanders.

    Now Barnes got the same deal. He forwarded the money. Didn’t give me any shit since then… And if I had been smart enough to insist you forwarded the money to me you wouldn’t have given me shit either……

    But in any case Barnes doesn’t want the bet. Its no fuss.

    So I got the psycology of it right with Barnes but I made a mistake with you.

    You are a filthy liar…. A complete bastard….. and totally dishonest…

    For you to be in a position to have a gentlemans wager on an equal level with me you would have to die and be born again.

    I fucking made that quite clear.

    So because your bet was bogus in the first place you held this stipulation over as your wimp out key.

    But as soon as I reluctantly ask for the bank number you dissapear and change your name.

    Because you are a low-down yella filthy piece of shit.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:32 pm

  232. re comment 228

    GB you have every right to refuse a bet for any reason you like until the point of time that you shake on the deal.
    If there was no agreement to the terms of the deals etc. there was no bet.

    You have every right to walk away from abet without ever having to explain you position to anyone and you have right not to be hounded about it.

    Its true lefties don’t understand term and contracts it seem it is beyond their intellectual level, like dogs when watching TV. It’s just a blur.

    Barnes tried some shit with me. He thought that Tim and I have agreed to a bet when we actually hadn’t agreed any terms and conditions of the tenure. Barnes put his big oversized head in the middle of it and he was obviously wrong. Tim and I had never agreed because we didn’t “shake” on it. No problem on either side and I bet with John when I realized Tim’s bet wasn’t happening.

    Now I didn’t ask Tim to come back and bet, I didn’t accuse Tim of welshing on a bet. As far as I was concerned he didn’t pursue it (probably forgot) and that was it. I just transferred the bet to John after that. But I didn’t yell and scream the bet was with the wrong person. It is everyone’s right to walk away from a bet before any terms are agreed. Get to understand things John instead of hounding people like a school yard bully.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:36 pm

  233. Which link, John? Jack S. It was on LP some months ago and I saw Jack refer to it somewhere here recently I think. It’s in the past cache.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:38 pm

  234. Calm down, Birdy. Breeeeeaaaathe deeply.
    Settled? Good.

    A gentlemen’s wager would not require an escrow. Jc, whatever else you can say about him, conducts business like a gentleman. We agreed on terms and both stuck to them.

    Given that neither of us trusts the other, an escrow is the fair alternative. You have a high opinion of c8to, as do I. Are you willing to use him as an escrow or not? Yes or no?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:39 pm

  235. You can see why I wanted the left to put up the cash and them have to trust me.

    But I didn’t count on the endless patience c8to has for friends.

    With one guy its not fuss.

    With the otther guy, whose a leftist…. its endless bullshit. Such that even if I WON the bet and c8to had to pay up I’d have been working for 50c and hour.

    A conservative cannot bet political bets with a leftist in 2006.

    He just can’t. They will never pay up.

    In 78 that would have been OK.

    Maybe in some isolated town in Western Australia it would be OK.

    This didn’t crash and burn because I made the betting rules one-sided.

    On the contrary. I didn’t make them one-sided enough…

    My idea was that once the lying left-winger had parted with his money and the money was out of his control the bastard would start talking some sense and stop talking shit for fear of losing his money…..

    I got it right with the honourable and redeemed Barnes.

    But I got it wrong with that low-life filth John whatever the dick is calling himself today.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:41 pm

  236. “It is easy to prove you are not lying, JC. Just link to the offending comment”

    Anothe ropen mind. Right off the bat you’re asking me to prove it, rather than asking Fyador what he said to jack. Is it true.
    Did he ask Jason not to remove the offending comment from Munn when he did it under my name? Or when Fyador thought it as Munny on Troppo?

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:41 pm

  237. I asked for the bank accout number didn’t I shit for brains?

    I asked for the bank account number and you dissapeared and changed your name.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:43 pm

  238. You have every right to walk away from abet without ever having to explain you position to anyone

    Correct.

    and you have right not to be hounded about it.

    Incorrect. In case you haven’t noticed, free speech is allowed on this forum. Bird’s conduct in this bet was disgraceful. With the exception of yourself, every person who has bothered to weigh in has agreed on this point. The forum has called him on it and you’re labrador like defense of his conduct calls your judgement into question.

    As for Fyodor’s comment, you’d think that someone who made such a big deal out of it would be bothered to use google to find it and PROVE it. You make the claim, you provide the proof buddy.

    If you’re struggling to find it, I’ll give you a free google tutorial.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:46 pm

  239. “A gentlemen’s wager would not require an escrow. Jc, whatever else you can say about him, conducts business like a gentleman. We agreed on terms and both stuck to them.”

    Don’t be a fucking idiot.

    I’m not conducting this as if you were a gentleman.

    You’re an asshole who owed me a retraction both before and after you pulled the leftist fraud-bet-distraction-manouvre.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:46 pm

  240. He just can’t. They will never pay up.

    Bird, you’re endlessly accusing me of this but NOT ONCE have you bothered to explain how it’s possible…. unless you think c8to is a thief and I assure you that he is not.

    you dissapeared and changed your name.

    I’m sorry that my appending a “Z” to the end of my name to differentiate myself from another “John” on LP confused you so.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:49 pm

  241. “Given that neither of us trusts the other, an escrow is the fair alternative. You have a high opinion of c8to, as do I. Are you willing to use him as an escrow or not? Yes or no?”

    No not good enough.

    Your assholery is established.

    You are clearly not to be trusted in a bet. That is established beyond any doubt and was established prior to you even coming up with the IDEA of a bet.

    You have NO right to distrust me. We are not on any sort of equal level.

    But the idea that I ought distrust you is a proven empirical fucking fact right from your failure to retract… And you subsequent substitution of a BET-BLUFF for a retraction.

    You’re a fucking idiot pal.

    And you’ll get beaten up bad if you are ever considering yourself on the same plane as me.

    You are not even a MAN mate.

    You’re dogshit.

    So whats this business about us being equal in our mutual distrust.

    Take that an shove that right up your well-travelled asshole.

    You are filth.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:51 pm

  242. JohnZ
    Ask Fyador to show you the comment he made to Jack S here. You can’t retrieve it at catallaxy, doofus.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 8:53 pm

  243. As you have shown.

    You were never prepared to pay up on a serious bet.

    And I’m never going to enhance the illusion that you and I are working on some sort of equal level.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:53 pm

  244. Bird,

    Explain in great detail how I could defraud you with c8to as the escrow.

    GO!!!!

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:54 pm

  245. I’ve already (reluctantly) asked for the bank account you fucking dishonest peice of filth.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:55 pm

  246. Jc, there are a number of caches on the web which can retrieve this sort of information. Was the post made on Catallaxy or LP?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:56 pm

  247. Ok, Bird, good. So we’re agreed on the need for an escrow.

    Now for the interesting bit. Under what conditions should one of us win and what should cause a draw?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 8:57 pm

  248. I already asked for the bank account.

    I tried to tell Jason that this JIVE was another distraction.

    Don’t think he believed me then.

    Wonder if he’ll believe me now.

    There has NEVER been a time when fuckhead here wasn’t in the process of wimping out and trying to pretend it was me.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 8:59 pm

  249. Jason: I don’t believe I challenged Eric to any sort of fight. I was only pointing out to an obviously deluded fool that a leftist revolution would be put down in minutes because:

    A:) Most lefties are pissweak, effeminate ladyboys.

    B:) Right-Wingers have all the guns and know how to use them.

    A statement of fact is not a challenge to fight.

    The last paragraph of my post was merely an observation about Blair’s own pigheadedness. Again, not a threat.

    Talking about fighting and agreeing to a fight are not the same thing. Don’t read between the lines so much, I’m usually not inserting anything there.

    Also interesting to note that Mark Bahsnich accused me of “inflammatory posting” while saying nothing at all about Blair’s own call to violent revolution about 10 posts previous.

    Does Mark actually still want people to take him seriously? Because the addition of Eric Blair to LP suggest he’s given up the fight and had admitted the Left are just a bunch of undergraduate idiots.

    yobbo

    October 23, 2006 at 9:03 pm

  250. John To be perfectly honest I wouldn’t want someone elses buddy holding my money when making a bet. Couldn’t give shit how honest he is. I would never do it.

    Like I said there are millions of reasans for walking away from a bet.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 9:20 pm

  251. Like I said there are millions of reasans for walking away from a bet.

    Yes, correct. If you don’t want to bet just SAY SO and save everyone else a whole lot of time.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 9:22 pm

  252. Yoobo

    Don’t worry about it. This is avery political site in a sense. you can offer a bet get hit, not go ahead with it and all is sweet.. You can decide to walk away from before the final hand shake and the world caves in on you.

    No one should have taken it as a threat to shoot the lousey leftist prick anyway.But if Eric Blair did try to start a revolution and someone did shoot him. No great loss.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 9:28 pm

  253. John

    It was on LP.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 9:30 pm

  254. Made on LP but also referred to here.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 9:30 pm

  255. Lets not pretend its me backing out here.

    I will not let anyone drop the connection between the LEAD UP to the bet and the terms I set.

    GMB

    October 23, 2006 at 9:30 pm

  256. JC: LP hasn’t lost its archives. Google can usually find these sorts of things very quickly…

    Bird: Let me know when the terms and conditions are ready.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 9:36 pm

  257. John how exactly. by using Fyador and the word coward? is that what you are saying?

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 9:39 pm

  258. Can you remember part of the comment? Can you remember any followup comments? Can you remember the topic at hand?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 9:42 pm

  259. Jack doing his usual schtik about western culture. Fyador than gets stuck into him for even mentioning western culture because fyador prefers islamic thugs. They then start talking about WW2.

    Keywords are coward… culture, 8th army ( Fyador’s) second uncle on his third stepdads side or somethign like that was in the 8th army…

    I did all the keyword searches but couldn’t get it.

    Jack would know. So ask jack.

    john I know how to use google.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 9:48 pm

  260. It took less than 30 seconds to find it this, JC. Is it what you’re after?

    http://larvatusprodeo.net/2005/09/11/american-arrested-and-deported-for-driving-on-the-wrong-side-of-the-road/#comment-26998

    “Auntie Jack, if your genetic theories had any validity, you’d be a superficial, albeit charming, coward…”

    Is THIS your racist remark? If so, grow a pair – you say worse things about Muslims…

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 9:51 pm

  261. you consider that to be only slightly racist , perhaps a little more thatn sightly or not at all?

    Forgive for asking john, but are you just in this to help the racist little vermon or to get to the truth.

    This is just one of the points I raised. I guess you have no problems with the other five, right?

    Sucking up to ” munny” is just a treasure isn’t it. Especially when Fyador thought “Munny” was going to go off on some identity theft driven racist rant.

    By the way I couldn’t give a shit about my background, but that’s my perogative, not the racist little vermon’s. I think you may recall recently when I told you to mind your own business when Munn was doing his racist routine that i don’t really care so much.

    ” Is THIS your racist remark? If so, grow a pair – you say worse things about Muslims”

    What have I said, that some have a problem with Westerners? You mind showing me where I have ever said I have a problem with all Muslims?

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:07 pm

  262. What have I said, that some have a problem with Westerners? You mind showing me where I have ever said I have a problem with all Muslims?

    Strawman. I never said you did…. nor did I say your comments were racist.

    you consider that to be only slightly racist , perhaps a little more thatn sightly or not at all?

    Notice that he said “IF your genetic theories”. i.e, IF your theories are true then these stereotypes apply to you. It was a joke. Find a sense of humour.

    Remember how you refer to the french as “frogs”. Same thing, mate.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 10:15 pm

  263. John

    You sing fyador’s songs about the gold thread. Would you mind in you own words telling us where exactlywhy he has been right?What is the economics he spouts that makes you think this?

    Your silence will be an admission of defeat and we should all assume retraction.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:16 pm

  264. Changing the topic so soon, Jc? Or do you concede that Fyodor is not a “racist”?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 10:21 pm

  265. ” Remember how you refer to the french as “frogs”. Same thing, mate. ” Not when I’m a quarter frog for all intents.

    ” Strawman. I never said you did…. nor did I say your comments were racist.”

    No it isn’t. you just don’t understand a strawman. you copmplained I attack Muslims. I ask for you to prove I attack all Muslims and now you throw in the frog angle. You’re the strawman on a moving target.

    ” It was a joke. Find a sense of humour.”

    I have a good sense. only thing is there was no humor in their discussion. Fyador was scratching at Jack and jack was trying to be a gentleman all the way through.

    Mind showing where either showed a sense of humor.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:24 pm

  266. What i concede is that your hiding and making excuses for him. He is a racist vermon. And the offer still holds.

    Want to comment ont eh ” Munny” deal?

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:25 pm

  267. Yobbo
    I was joking dude, lighten up!

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 10:29 pm

  268. Not when I’m a quarter frog for all intents.

    AFAIK, weathergirl is part Israeli – that didn’t stop you from implying she was anti-semitic.

    Here is a lesson in strawmen:

    you copmplained I attack Muslims
    I ask for you to prove I attack all Muslims

    Notice a slight difference in those two statements?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 10:30 pm

  269. Jc, you’d be a much more pleasant person if you lightened up a little and stopped trying to find things to be outraged about. Maybe get more sleep, spend more time with your wife or perhaps cut back on blog reading before you have a triple bypass at 60.

    Anyway, this stoush is boring so I’m off for a while. Hopefully Bird will come back with those conditions, or enough courage to admit he doesn’t want to bet anymore.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 10:33 pm

  270. John
    Well I would have to assume you were implying I attack all Muslims. I would expect all reasonable people to attack the Islamic thugs. What you can’t distinguish in a Fyador sort of way. Now onder you support his actions. What about the other 5 points. And how about defending his economics instead of leaving one small sized turd on the thread we have to clean up.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:35 pm

  271. Well I would have to assume you were implying I attack all Muslims.

    You assumed wrong, as usual. It’s these assumptions that make you so irritating, Jc.
    If you actually read what people wrote and responded to their words rather than attributing every conceivable leftist opinion to anyone who disagrees with you then you’d be a much more credible figure.

    Maybe I’ll offer you and your wife some free marriage counselling for xmas – cos if this is the way you talk normally, god help your friends and family.

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 10:45 pm

  272. John
    you’re dropping all these little turds around the palce that i simply can’t clean up by myself. It gets too hard and not worth the bother.

    Are you going to tell us what Fyador gets right with his econmics, instead of doing a homer and trying to analyse me?

    He’s some friendly advice to you, Pick better friends. Fyador sides with a known racist and calls him ” Munny” to be so nice. Accuses jack of being a coward in a racist way. He attacks Jack and CL for expressing concerns about Muslims thugs. Some friend you have there, John.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 10:54 pm

  273. Ok, Jc. Let’s talk issues – but on the condition that you only respond to whatI write.

    We’ll start with the basics: Do you think fractional reserve is fraud?

    JohnZ

    October 23, 2006 at 11:42 pm

  274. John Z: “We’ll start with the basics: Do you think fractional reserve is fraud?”

    Christ, Buddha, Muhammad and Zoaraster in a boat – not again! Can’t you two just settle this with an arm wrestle or a drinking contest? 🙂

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 11:49 pm

  275. What happened to Bird? Did you scare him away, JohnZ?

    Jason Soon

    October 23, 2006 at 11:52 pm

  276. John
    I thought you were going to give us your understanding what Fyador wrote?

    Ok let’s go.

    Yes and no. I think the present system is a total crock of shit. Is it a fraud in a legalitic way? Of course not. However fractional is used by central banks to practice shocking, actually quite shocking currency debauch on the citizens by allowing the money supply to grow at such staggering rates.

    If we had private money I wouldn’t be too concerned with fractional as the market would tell us and the banks what level of leverage is acceptable.

    Nothwithstandiang what Fyador tells you the central banks have to supply whatever liquidity is demanded at the set interest rate level. Sure they may guess right, but if you look at their history it isn’t that great.

    If the RBA was honorable in its actions they wopuld only supply the amount of mney that was needed to provide for economic growth and no more.

    Rampant asset price inflation has been the result of these actions.

    So yes it is a fraud, but not in a legal way. Better call it a total con job.

    jc

    October 23, 2006 at 11:59 pm

  277. Look my issue isn’t with fractional so much as I don’t think that is causing the problem. Fractional is the vehicle the central banks usees to allow the multiplier to leverage up high powered money through the banking system.

    My issue is monetary policy the RBa applies to conduct it’s activities. Rather than target interest rates, the Rba should target a certain growth rate in monetary aggregates each year and nothing more. That means that they could no longer set the onvernight rate of interest.

    This way you wouldn’t be seeing asset price inflation.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:08 am

  278. Wow. That was painless.

    Now to bubbles. Do you think they’re always caused by monetary expansion or do they sometimes just happen?

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 12:10 am

  279. Jason.
    this is THE MOST IMPORTANT area of economics. you get this right and most othjer things fall into place. Don’t underestimate monetary economics and the importance it plays in quelling people’s natural tenency to do bad stuff.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:11 am

  280. Always. Bubbles are are a monetary problem.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:12 am

  281. Yeah, I always thought that fractional reserve was pretty much irrelevent to your argument.
    I once had a chat with a guy who worked for the RBA and his point was that they know how much money they need to supply and simply factor the multiplier into the equation.

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 12:14 am

  282. As for Bird – who knows. Perhaps he has requested c8to’s account details…

    Personally I think he should focus on the bet terms and save himself and c8to some trouble…

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 12:19 am

  283. Jason: Since Mark B. has deleted the posts you referred to and chastised me for “inflammatory remarks” I have to assume that people think I made a serious threat.

    yobbo

    October 24, 2006 at 12:21 am

  284. (and also closed the thread so I am unable to defend myself from Bahnisch’s lies).

    yobbo

    October 24, 2006 at 12:22 am

  285. If bubbles are caused by monetary expansion, why is it that it only inflates one asset class?
    Surely we’d expect a general price level rise?

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 12:25 am

  286. Yes John and that’s the problem. They don’t know and aren’t too fussed with the aggregates, as they have taken their eye off the ball. They think like Fyador… actually Fyador speaks the language of a central banker……. That it no longer matters if the monetary aggregates are growing faster than GDP because they feel they can’t control it. Of course they can’t control it because they are setting the price of short term money and if more is demanded at the set rate they are obliged to supply it under the current system.

    I actually think world monetary policy was derailed with the recession in the English speaking working in the late80’s early 90’s. In certain ways that was the closest we ever came to a full blown depression, both here, the US and the UK. Rather than looking at the problem as why we got into that mess in the first place, that is , why did they let the monetary aggregates go during the 80’s they looked at the recession and have been spooked ever since about how damn close we came to a depression. They actually think it was tight money that got us there, when in fact the problem was loose money policies. So since then they have been loathe in tightening hard. Sure at times they have tightened a little, but nowhere near the level they should. For God’s sake they were even loosening up in the US for a 2000 bug, which was the biggest crock of shit I have ever seen. So what we have now is a flight to hard assets. You can’t keep money as cash any longer because it gets taken away at around 8% per year. Cash is not king and never will be until they err back to where they should be going.

    Fractional makes the system unstable, but we could live with it if they were prudent in the way they ran monetary policy.

    I grew up in the market when they were actually targeting something. At least the US was targeting bank reserves as a way of managing monetary policy. However they went off that standard under Volker and Greenspan loved it because it gave the central bankers more sway.

    Look the only bank that ran things properly in the 90’s was the Bundesbank, possibly the greatest central bank of modern times. They understood all this shit. The Swiss national bank was also up there too, until they also caught the disease and went soft.
    These guys believe there is a free lunch. All they are doing is promoting borrowing and large amounts of speculation. Don’t get me wrong. I like the system we have because I understand what to do with things. But I genuinely worry about the average person in the street who doesn’t and has no hard assets to protect themselves with. I actually do care a lot about the poor and that’s why I want to see a change in the system. All it does is promote inequality in ways you never thought possible before. The reason inequality is worsening is because the rich are into hard assets and the stock market while the poor are very income dependent. Inequality will continue to rise while we continue wit this monetary system. And all you see is capitalism getting the blame, when it isn’t capitalism’s fault that the richer are getting richer. In fact they’re not , as all they are doing is pegging to hard assets and the stock market, while others aren’t.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:45 am

  287. “If bubbles are caused by monetary expansion, why is it that it only inflates one asset class?
    Surely we’d expect a general price level rise? ”

    Well we don’t know where the money is going to go. And it dosn’t go into just one asset class. It actually goes into many asset classes.

    It’s very much a rotational thing.

    The stock market has many categories. In the late 90’s asset price inflation was felt with in tech stocks. I then went into the housing market. It then went into commodity stocks. It has recently been felt in commercial real estate… Yields for office blocks have fallen below 6% in certain segments. It ha also been felt now in top end real estate where in Melbourne the top end has gone up nearly 35this year. So assets class is the wrong way to look at it. You need to strip it down and look harder at where the money is going. Look at International stocks…. The Nikkei has boomed over the past 24 months and the real estate market there has gone up enormously.

    The US….. real estate has fallen a bit but the stock market has gone gang busters hitting a record high for big cap stocks.

    The inflation is the 70’s was felt in goods and services which for the moment seems well behaved. So you don’t know where the money is going to be dumped.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:57 am

  288. ” Surely we’d expect a general price level rise?”

    We should but China is putting pressue on goods and services all over world keeping thje CPI well behaved. We also have enormous gains in the tech sector where price falls are kepping a lid on the CPI.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:59 am

  289. What I’m getting at is that bubbles seem to be a result of herd behaviour more than anything.

    i.e. First one asset is inflated and after that one bursts another asset is inflated.and so forth. Now you may argue that cheap money facilitates these bubbles, but it is not an explanation in itself.
    The fact that interest rates are at 3% doesn’t force people to buy PetFoodOnline shares for $100 a pop. Greed and the herd mentality does that.

    Remember that if money is cheap people can borrow to sell short as well…

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 1:10 am

  290. Yes that’s true, which is why you cannot predicit where the money is going to go. In other words bubbles are a symptom of monetary malaise.

    It doesn’t force people to buy the pet food stock, it entices people to speculate. Momentum is an entirely different thing… a human emotion.

    look, I see it in my own activity as well. We call it carry trades. This is when people take positions in currencies because the interest rate carry or differential is great enough that people will take a punt hoping to earn the interest difference.. They think they have a chance to take risk and make money with the carry. You saw this this year with people taking risk in the Brazilian Real. Firstly people went in the for carry trade, then momenteum traders saw the currency take off as it got bid up by these traders and away it goes. Same emotion.

    Loose policy aids in promoting speculation. you can talk about the pet food stock going to $100 becasue specs took it there. But you have to ask what caused that stock and all the others in that class to move up the way they did.

    ABL nailed this down perfectly when he said on the doom thread that bad monetary policy aids credit mispricing. thats the best damn explanation i have ever seen. Ever.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 1:37 am

  291. Loose policy aids in promoting speculation

    Yes, but is it a necessary condition? Human greed and stupidity are present regardless of the interest rate. Cheap credit fans the flames, but it doesn’t start the fire.

    Have a read of some about some of the behavioural finance experiments. It is easy to create bubbles without a central bank.

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 1:50 am

  292. Ok
    Does monetyary expnansion cause bubbles. yes massively so. Are all forms of speculation the cause of monetary expansion possibly not.

    However all broad based bubbles are, no question.

    I wouldn’t blame monetary expansion as the reason why poker playing has suddnely become popular. But I woud blame monetary expansion for the cause of our real estate markets doing what they are, which is a broad based boom.

    That money they dish out is going somewhere.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:00 am

  293. I think you are confusing say a craze in something or other compared to bubbles that are the rsult of bad monetary policy.
    Take a look at Japan in the early 90’s. The emperor’s palace was worth more than the entire state of california. that’s a bubble caused by bad money policies.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:06 am

  294. You see I actually don’t think it is the specific rate on interest that the qualifier. it’s the growth of the aggregates and the central balnks balance sheet that is the issue.

    read James Grnats money of the mind. He’s the one true Austrian economist on Wall s
    street and has his own newsletter that the entire mstreet reads. He’s a gold guy too.

    He’s an excellent writer. He came out of Jp morgan where he worked as an economist.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:11 am

  295. James Grant
    Sorry I get real tired this hour.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:12 am

  296. It’s an old book. I can send it Jason if you want and then return it through him.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:13 am

  297. John.

    There isn’t going to be a speculative bubble in wheet-bix following a monetary expansion is there.

    Since speculative bubbles involve people attempting to get rich on the greater-fool-theory.

    So there has to be some sort of medium-term supply constraints to whatever it is you are buying.

    But a dopey bastard or a Keynesian will look at the supply constraints and pretend he doesn’t see the monetary expansion.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 2:24 am

  298. “Thankyou, Fyodor, for educational services rendered to the Australian blogosphere.”

    You’re too kind, sir. And perhaps a little foolhardy to be heaping such praise on the object of so much histrionic loathing.

    I must say I’m impressed with YOUR patience in the face of Dumb & Dumberer’s shambolic ineptitude. Fancy not knowing how to use Google, eh? On the Internet, everyone can see you fuck up.

    Also, many thanks for this piece of drollery:

    ” If you ever find the honesty to admit that he’s right, I suggest you send him a thankyou note and perhaps some chocolates for his patience in explaining basic economics to an amatuer like yourself.”

    Mine’s a Haighs Hazelnut Block, Birdy. You know, in case you were wondering what to do with that money you stole.

    P.S. adding a “y” to the end of Munn’s name is no more affectionate than adding “y” to the end of Joe, JC.

    Fyodor

    October 24, 2006 at 10:20 am

  299. Thankyou, Fyodor, for educational services rendered to the Australian blogosphere.”

    You’re too kind, sir. And perhaps a little foolhardy to be heaping such praise on the object of so much histrionic loathing

    Shorter Fyador. Here’s one person i’ve hoodwinked I am not a thread wrecker.

    “must say I’m impressed with YOUR patience in the face of Dumb & Dumberer’s shambolic ineptitude. Fancy not knowing how to use Google, eh? On the Internet, everyone can see you fuck up.

    Also, many thanks for this piece of drollery:”

    Shorter Fyador: If suck up to John, he may forget a I am a racist creep.

    .” adding a “y” to the end of Munn’s name is no more affectionate than adding “y” to the end of Joe,”

    Shorter Fyador. Let’s hope they’ll forget I support a racist turd.

    Fyador must be counting his blessing John appeared, I must admit I even felt sorry for him with Laime by his side.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 12:27 pm

  300. Fyador.
    Cl’s been hanging round here recently. i’m sure you can start a stoush with him seeing he’s an oppponent of Islamic thugs.

    Fyador, of course thinks CL is wrong to be so harsh on them when there are far better targets …How about people with Italian backgrounds? How easy and he can team up with “Munny”

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 1:51 pm

  301. You’re just embarassing yourself now, Mary.

    Unbunch those panties and take a deep breath before you burst a vessel.

    Fyodor

    October 24, 2006 at 2:21 pm

  302. Embarrassing myself? Angry? No.
    I guess you dumped Liame as the sidekick and picked up “Munny”. Good choice for a racist creep like you.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:29 pm

  303. Aww, I think somebody needs a hug. Birdy?

    Fyodor

    October 24, 2006 at 2:32 pm

  304. Fyador.

    I wouldn’t crow about John’s support. He never needed converting. i recall he thought that real estate prices went up because they changed zoning laws.

    Stick with “Munny”. He’ll teach you a few more things about how to become a blog racist.

    Remember how you used give me hell for supporting GB? Is that on the same plane as supporting “Munny” the racist Italian hater?

    Let’s ask a few peeple shall we?

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 2:38 pm

  305. Be my guest, Birdfriend.

    They’ll probably find you as ridiculous as I do right now. Who knows? You might even get a laugh or two. At your expense, most probably, but it’s a start for one as comedically challenged as yourself.

    Fyodor

    October 24, 2006 at 2:44 pm

  306. Birdfriend ? Does that equate to Munnchkin friend? Does Liame know you dropped him for a racist? Tears running down the sweet cheeks.

    I actually stick by my friends through thick and thin. Not like you dropping Liame for Munny. how cute is that?

    Now go see if CL is free so you can stoush with him over your favourite group.. Islamic radical murderers.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 3:09 pm

  307. Yairs, JC, it’s the sticking to Birdy we’re worried about. Talk about sweet cheeks…

    “Now go see if CL is free so you can stoush with him over your favourite group.. Islamic radical murderers.”

    Haven’t heard of them – are they on iTunes?

    Fyodor

    October 24, 2006 at 3:37 pm

  308. Sorry to interrupt the stoush.

    Just to keep Yobbo happy and correct the record, the comment of his which I deleted (and it’s worth noting that I deleted the response from Eric Blair as well) went something along the lines of “if Eric wants to advocate violent revolution, how would he like it if I shot him?”. That’s from memory as it’s gone. I wasn’t intending to suggest that Yobbo made a serious threat of violence, but I still think that a comment like that is inappropriate.

    Resume normal stoushing…

    Mark Bahnisch

    October 24, 2006 at 3:45 pm

  309. Don’t you project your filthy-sodomite tendencies onto other people Fyodor.

    Geez if it wasn’t bad enough that you had PHEROMONES THAT GRAB ME (EDIT BY ADMIN) and were a compulsive liar.

    You also are a sexual pervert as well?

    What next?

    You going to get cancer this Christmas or something.

    You have a retraction to make on the other thread.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 3:49 pm

  310. Jason.

    All you have to do is get rid of this idiot.

    He stands around pretending to know something about monetary economics. He knows a little, all of it wrong but thats just a little bit more then the laity.

    Its really a very easy subject. I could show people all about it. Its not even a difficult thing.

    But we have found its not possible that people can learn this stuff so as to make an honest judgement call if someone is here lying page after page.

    Now why don’t you just chuck him off.

    You haven’t actually LEARNT anything from him have you?

    No-one has.

    He’s a head-case to be studied by psycologists to see why he does this.

    He’s even taken the highly sensible Hard Currency Lad in. He’s totally befuddled and retarded Reynolds learning since Reynolds was led to believe that Fyodor ahd some sort of point.

    Just throw him off. Then we ought to try and get Jackson on. I mean there’s a fellow that really has his act together.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 3:55 pm

  311. It’s an exaggeration to say I’ve been taken in by anyone, Bird. It’s not in my nature to be bamboozled into intellectual acquiescence.

    C.L.

    October 24, 2006 at 5:05 pm

  312. No there is no doubt you were taken in.

    You were expressing how impressed you were with Fyodor on the thread of doom.

    There was just no doubt that he had you fooled as well.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 5:57 pm

  313. You don’t need to go around insulting everyone’s intelligence, Birdy. We can look after ourselves thank you very much without you deciding who you want banned. You’re not the smartest person on this blog, you know.

    Jason Soon

    October 24, 2006 at 5:59 pm

  314. No no.

    You are intelligent guys and you were both taken in by this lunatic.

    Actually I think you are STILL taken in. You think he has even the slightest clue of what he’s talking about.

    The guys a godamned nutcase.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 6:26 pm

  315. “You’re not the smartest person on this blog, you know.”

    Well actually I AM.

    But thats neither here nor there.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 6:29 pm

  316. I haven’t been taken in by anyone, capiche?

    C.L.

    October 24, 2006 at 8:28 pm

  317. You were taken in by Fyodor.

    CAPICHE?

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 8:29 pm

  318. Cozzie bro
    I know you’re smart. But you’re not that smart.

    I’ve been looking around this here digs a while and there are some fellas here seem smarter than you – Soon, c8to and CL for starters.

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 24, 2006 at 8:31 pm

  319. Birdy,

    It’s plainly obvious to everyone except JC that Fyodor knows more about banking and monetary policy than you do. Stop PROJECTING your insecurity onto the rest of us and start taking notes.

    You have a lot to learn.

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 8:33 pm

  320. No thats not true.

    But they are all smart guys.

    Yet c8tos the only one that hasn’t been taken in by Fyodor to my knowledge.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 8:33 pm

  321. Ha Ha.

    JohnZ also taken in by Fyodor.

    But thats nothing. The other guys were smart guys. But JohnZ is a first-class bone-head.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 8:35 pm

  322. Kiwi Bird II,

    Are you actually related to Birdy?

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 8:37 pm

  323. Ha Ha Ha Ha.

    This is the first time I’ve actually welcomed your arrival for a very long time.

    Just when people were starting to forget that they were taken in by Fyodor along comes some dope that is STILL taken in by Fyodor.

    TEE HEE.

    GMB

    October 24, 2006 at 8:39 pm

  324. Don’t do that TEE HEE, Graeme. You sound like a giggling girl.

    Jason Soon

    October 24, 2006 at 8:40 pm

  325. Credit where it’s due Birdy – your skin does thicken quickly.

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 8:41 pm

  326. ABL certainly hasn’t either and I would be very surprised if he wasn’t an economist. Where is he these days anyway? I miss the economics lessons.

    JohnZ
    Please!!!!!. What Fyador spouts is a Keynesian rank washed up with lies and disortions. He accused Jackson of being a quack, when even someone as daft as you when it comes to economic theory would know that is spoken by a lying dickhead.

    Anyway last night I was kind to you and answered all your questions after you ill mannerly asked before you answered. Yes it was late and I was tired so I wasn’t feeling like getting into another stoush with you.

    Seeing you “fink” Fearless is right, would you mind telliing us why his views are so much better. And just because you want to make the creature fell good won’t cut it as answer.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 8:47 pm

  327. John

    I think you had better check in to the latest thread of doom and see what’s happening. Miss F’s dress just got caught in the car door and left showing his panty hose and underwear. The dress took off with the car. Recall he linked us to this site saying the goldsmiths were the inventors of fractional lending? Well his own link refers to much earlier periods where this was happening. In short. He’s fucked.
    Best you ask Soon to erase that rank stupidity you just posted. I won’t ever breathe a word of what you said. that’s the sort of nice person i am, doofus.

    jc

    October 24, 2006 at 8:54 pm

  328. Anyway last night I was kind to you and answered all your questions after you ill mannerly asked before you answered.

    Jc, I’ve got better things to do than prove my “worth” to you. Happy to discuss the issues, as long as you can refrain from playing strawman.

    Cheers for the offer of the book btw, maxed out with deadlines till mid-December but might be up for it if I find free time after that.

    JohnZ

    October 24, 2006 at 8:54 pm

  329. JohnZ – check your email, I sent you a query.

    Jason Soon

    October 24, 2006 at 8:57 pm

  330. GMB, I’ve been having blues with Fyodor for about two years. I have often admired his capacity to put a case – even when I personally find the substantive argument itself to be wrong. That’s all I meant to convey by saying I found some of his banking contributions to be “extremely impressive”. I also made it CLEAR that I was not expert enough to judge on the question of who was right. I’ll leave that to the pros. Not taken in, then, but willing to acknowledge an applause-worthy manoeuvre. I think even you have credited Fyodor’s smarts as a debater – even if you don’t respect his broader intentions.

    Bird, I find your knowledge of the subject (and other subjects) to be extraordinary and your Kiwi bro, respectfully, is wrong – there is no way I am smarter than you. Or smarter than Fyodor, Jc, Sinclair, Homer, c8to, SL and most of the other contributors here, for that matter. (Excluding Munn). That, by the way, is my rational judgement – not cheap self-effacement. Vis-a-vis me, the aforementioned opinion of you is based on perception formed during my upbringing, an upbringing in which men of the world – not men of letters – were the biggest influences. I know Jason sees you as a colourful and formidable kind of savant and I think he’s right.

    But you know this already. 😉

    Like I said, I don’t know who’s winning the argument on the thread of doom. Maybe Jason should select a small panel of academics to read the whole thing and pronounce a winner.

    Best regards to the whole Tulip mafia…

    C.L.

    October 24, 2006 at 11:26 pm

  331. Thanks for your comments, CL. Very kind of you, particularly as you received the predictable response from the peanut gallery for your trouble.

    Returning the favour, I’ve always found you highly impressive as a debater, with a strong intellect and an excellent grasp of the key points of an argument. I disagree with much of what you say, but I generally respect your debating style. You’re a consistent source of high quality stoush.

    Fyodor

    October 25, 2006 at 10:28 am

  332. What a love-fest we have in here!

    Jason Soon

    October 25, 2006 at 10:32 am

  333. “Thanks for your comments, CL. Very kind of you, particularly as you received the predictable response from the peanut gallery for your trouble. ”

    Isn’t it nauseating when he’s trying nice.

    “Returning the favour, I’ve always found you highly impressive as a debater, with a strong intellect and an excellent grasp of the key points of an argument.”

    Shorter Yador: Hell would have to freeze over before I gave you a complement first, CL.

    “I disagree with much of what you say, but I generally respect your debating style.”

    If you left the muslims alone, and never mention that fact that they blow westerners, I won’t have a problem with you.

    “You’re a consistent source of high quality stoush. ”

    Yes he is, he’s not a lying dickhead like you Yador.

    jc

    October 25, 2006 at 10:50 am

  334. Trust JC to wreck the love-fest …

    Send JC into a hippie commune and he’ll turn them into Red Staters overnight.

    Jason Soon

    October 25, 2006 at 10:54 am

  335. CL
    You obviously missed Yador previous behavior.

    He attempted to find out if Bird worked at the CBA and posted it. He ousted some innocent person with the same name as Bird giving out details of the department where he worked and denigrating what this person did for a living mistakenly thinking it was Bird. He was trying to out him. But was the wrong person. This is one of he reasons Bird gives the prick a hard time

    So I wouldn’t be too fast in passing complements. He also tried the racist angle with “Munny” as he affectionately refers to him against me. He’s an unethical, dishonest dickhead, CL.

    jc

    October 25, 2006 at 11:02 am

  336. OK. Here’s an interesting question for you guys.

    Is a person’s beauty their own property? And, if true, does its nonexcludability make it a public good?

    Amir

    October 25, 2006 at 11:35 am

  337. Love-fest, Jason? The pseudo-masculine love-fest around here is often of gay bathhouse proportions and I’m not one of the oiled up Adonises.

    Jc, I don’t really know anything about those matters re outing Bird etc. You know my opinion on Munn was settled by the “greasy” comment directed at you – which I read with my own eyes a few Saturdays ago. That and Munn’s irrational Christophobia. If Fyodor went real-world investigative on somebody’s arse, I’d be interested to know why he did that and I would condemn that.

    C.L.

    October 25, 2006 at 12:28 pm

  338. “Kiwi Bird II,

    Are you actually related to Birdy?”

    Darned right I am related to the windbag fathead, JohnZ. Darned right. Why do you think he lets me insult him like that without firing back?

    Of course I still have the walking blubber confused because he still hasn’t worked out which one of his relos I am. Tee Hee

    Kiwi Bird II

    October 25, 2006 at 10:32 pm

  339. Kiwi Bird

    The bird or Prey also makes that Tee Hee sound. Is that a kiwi thing we big city folk don’t understand or is it genetic.

    Just askin..

    jc

    October 25, 2006 at 11:36 pm

  340. Kiwi:

    Has he ever used the words “utopian eschatologist” at a family reunion?

    JohnZ

    October 25, 2006 at 11:49 pm

  341. John,
    that’s just a religious freak. That’s all teh Bird of prey means when he says that. You ought to know that shit.

    jc

    October 25, 2006 at 11:54 pm

  342. Imagine a whole flock of drunk Birds at a Xmas dinner.

    Where would they get their red wine supplies from?

    Jason Soon

    October 25, 2006 at 11:56 pm

  343. Kiwi Bird II,

    So GMB is of NZ stock? Well that doesn’t surprise me. Pleeease tell us more.

    CL, the greasy reference in relation to JC had nothing to do with race. More than half my friends are O/S born and my partner is Asian. I am clearly not a racist.

    The Christophobia thing is also bullshit. I ridicule faux Christians such as yourself because of your hypocrisy. Christian Rightists such as yourself take the Christ out of Christianity and that is what sickens me. What the fuck happened to blessed are the peacemakers, forgiveness and the meek shall inherit the earth and all that other soul enriching stuff?

    I have a framed copy of the Sermon on the Mount in my study. Maybe you should read it sometime.

    melaleuca

    October 26, 2006 at 12:07 am

  344. Munn
    Get a sack and stop lying to CL. You have made numerous racist comments towards me, numerous… even JohnZ once had enough of your vile personal shit you were spewing on the site.. So don’t go lying to people.
    You’re a racist. You have made numerous racist comments towards me because I disagree with your rancid views about economics and other economic growth destroying swill you try to spring on unsuspecting innocents.
    You are also a thief, having stolen my identity and made racist comments under my name. That really pissed me off because if you do the little things you quite capable of doing big things.

    Now this doesn’t worry me and I couldn’t give a shit you’re a racist or that you throw racist comments my way. In fact it was quite amusing that the only thing you could resort to was racism of the vilest kind. Seriously, I couldn’t give a shit.

    But don’t think that you are going to lie about it and get away with it, because I will hold you up on this whenever possible.

    So stop lying.

    What’s with that pathetic website you put up anyways? What dung heap did you score that silly name? You mind if I visit sometimes or will you just delete my comments and ban me?

    As I said get a sack you wimp.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 12:29 am

  345. Where would they get their red wine supplies from?

    Hoses to a barrel (s). Jeesh the bird of prey can drink.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 12:30 am

  346. Munn
    You have a total of 7 comments on that website. You’re not exctly getting the eyeballs are you Mr. crushing bore. It’s not exactly the daily Kos is it.

    So I’ll do you a favour and post there if you want. That way I can help and boost traffic for you.

    Now don’t go all racist on me now, I’m trying to help you dude.

    “Melaleuca”. Ffs, munnchkin, what sort of forgetable name is that dude?

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 12:39 am

  347. Google is your friend, JC

    http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s1366335.htm

    The Meuleleuca quinquenervia, or broad leafed paper bark grows naturally in swampy areas along the eastern coast of Australia, but also in Papua New Guinea and New Caledonia. These trees are known as paper barks because of the wonderful thick, papery bark that peels from them in sheets, and is extremely attractive.

    This tree is grown for its bark but also displays pretty, fluffy, white flowers in autumn that are typical of plants in the Myrtaceae family – the same family as the eucalypts. When the flowers finish, they leave a decorative woody capsule that contains seed. These trees are easily grown from cuttings, as well as seed. These trees might reach 25 metres grown in the wild, but in gardens maximum height might be between 9 and15 metres.

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 12:44 am

  348. Munnchkin names his site after a weed? You smoking that shit Munn or doing something else with it.

    Change the name Munnch. Change it to “I hate Sicilian/ Calabrian wogs”( you wrote that , recall). Try that and see how you go in collecting viewership. It may actually do ok with the troops over and green life daily. They have to hate someone and it may as well be wogs like me for a change.

    Munnch, I can post there right?
    Melaluca (or whatever). Change it. It’s a friggen horrible name.

    Hey douchebag, since when are the meek ever going to inherit the earth? There’s plenty of Hummer driving christians that will make it throught the pearly gates. you don’t have to drive a Prius to get through, idiot.

    When i see you trying to bang on on the door, I’ll let you in….. Yea sure. You’ve got as much chance of gettingt through those gates Munn as Bob Brown does in saying something that makes economic sense.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 12:56 am

  349. I can’t believe Munn actually used the “some of my best friends” defence. And I must have missed the bit in the Sermon on the Mount where Our Lord advised Christophobic liars to express a desire to have wombs so they could have celebratory abortions.

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 1:08 am

  350. Munnch has had an abortion? Munnch, where did you fess up to that one, not on Gerry Springer?

    CL, munnch thinks you have to live in a cave to inherit the earth. But he certainly ain’t meek.

    Munnch

    I left a post over at meaculpa or what ever. Don’t delete it ok? That’s 8 comment now.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 1:17 am

  351. Hey, you must be doing something right, Munny – JayCee’s nearly as obsessed with you as he is with me.

    [Awaits screeching hysterics from Mary]

    Fyodor

    October 26, 2006 at 7:51 am

  352. Melaleuca quinquenervia is also a little Aussie trooper that is kicking some American arse. http://www.floridaplants.com/Eflora/melaleuca_quinquenervia.htm

    CL, your obsession with abortion verges on being an OCD. Get treated, dude.

    The Bible contains hundreds of references to slaves, including how to brand them, sell them and pierce their bodies. It also contains hundreds of references to animal sacrifices. At best it contains a couple of references to abortion and Christ said nothing about it.

    How about you set about burning witches and stoning sabbath breakers?

    “Exodus 22:18 Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.”

    “Exodus 31:14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. “

    melaleuca

    October 26, 2006 at 10:09 am

  353. Fyador

    What’s wrong with you two racists. Not having a sack is a serious problem.

    Munny, as you call him, is like you now denying he is a racism little scum bag.

    You look like a handsome couple.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 10:23 am

  354. Munn is allegedly a male who wishes he had a uterus so he can have a celebratory abortion.

    Seek psychiatric help, loser.

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 12:56 pm

  355. I love it when JC gets self-righteous – you can see the old duffer’s nose grow longer. Munnkey wanna banana?

    Hey Jase, what’s the deal with closing down comments on the porky pig thread?

    Dunno ’bout you, but I thought the irony was delicious, if not the pork pies.

    Fyodor

    October 26, 2006 at 2:33 pm

  356. Yep I was going to apologise for my snide tone in the last comment I made there.

    Laura

    October 26, 2006 at 2:36 pm

  357. Fyodor and Laura – the thread closing was SL’s decision and as she is the thread author I’ll leave it up to her.

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 2:38 pm

  358. What is the reference to not giving somebody’s name to Crikey about, may I ask?

    And in answer to your question, no, not much is happening in Melbourne. I’m waiting for someone who should have been here ten minutes ago.

    Laura

    October 26, 2006 at 2:40 pm

  359. PP, I deleted your re-comment on the open forum, not Jason. Jason deleted your comment on the Piggy post. I closed the thread.

    I am not given to banning people and I think you can do better than personal attacks, but like Andrew Norton I will ban you if you continue to post actionable material.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 3:04 pm

  360. ok SL, my post wasn’t actionable or a personal attack but here it is rephrased.

    [EDIT BY ADMIN]

    ADMIN: This version (which I’ve still edited, because I can) isn’t actionable. The last one was, which is why we removed it. As I said, I think you can do better than personal attacks. I do not wish to place you in moderation but will do so if I feel it is appropriate.

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 3:11 pm

  361. Cue Homer to change his handle to ‘bring back PP at catallaxy’?

    Liam

    October 26, 2006 at 3:12 pm

  362. I’m leaning towards “nonskepticlawyer” myself.

    Zoe

    October 26, 2006 at 3:16 pm

  363. ROTFLMAO! (is that actionable?)

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 3:24 pm

  364. No, Zoe is funny. Unlike some people. 😉

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 3:26 pm

  365. actually, SL i was laughing at you for your absurd notion that merely quoting words you used in an interview with channel 9 could be “actionable” (whatever that means)

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 3:28 pm

  366. Ummm, PP, this country has really stupid defamation laws. And now I know how to use them, I will use them. Yes that’s hypocritical (chalk that up as another entry in PP’s ‘SL is an evil shithead’ file), and even more it’s probably wrong. But I’m not above using the law to hammer people who aren’t lawyers (insert lawyer joke of your choice here).

    Just sayin.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 3:31 pm

  367. SL, how on earth can quoting your own words from a national tv interview possibly be actionable defamation?

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 3:48 pm

  368. That’s real funny CL. Wouldn’t be surprised if Munny and Fyador appear on Jerry Springer with munny explaining he had a sex change and impregnated by fyador ( of course) to experience the wonderful feeling of an abortion.

    I’d pay good money to watch that segment. Especially if the Bird of Prey and I could get front row seats.

    Fyador of course would be raising his finger at us as he’s caressing Munny”s hand while Birdy’s booing and calling out Jerry, jerry, jerry! Fyador finally pulls his trousers ( or skirt) down to show us his backside.

    Fyodor.

    Is the only form of abuse left for you to do after the racist stuff— the old age thing? Man ( or girl) you’re messed up, Miss Banana index.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 3:55 pm

  369. It’s not about what someone says, but whether it’s true or not, PP. I happen to be able to prove that Ch9’s little exercise isn’t true, which gives me legal leverage.

    I know, dumb as dog shit, and the libertarian in me desperately wants to see those sorts of laws changed (see here for details, but that’s how it is).

    I can provide the court with the circumstances of the interview, that I was induced into doing it under false pretenses, and that means basically Ch 9 and anyone who quotes them is toast. The article I’ve linked goes into why I think this stupid system needs to change.

    That said, everyone else uses the system to their advantage, so I figure I may as well do the same thing. Petty? Yes. Nasty? That too. But it gives me the sort of leverage I’ve never had in my life before. See here for even more details.

    This isn’t a reflection on you, and right now I’m sick and off work, so that probably explains a fair bit.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 4:03 pm

  370. Faaark, Munnkey…

    You drop that load of bollocks and you reckon I’m the one who’s messed up? I hope you’ve told your therapist about these fantasies of yours.

    You’re weird, dude. Totally fruity.

    Fyodor

    October 26, 2006 at 4:09 pm

  371. Jeepers.

    I was quite enjoying reading PP’s historical insights.

    I’m seeing you getting edited a bunch.

    But I can’t judge what it is because I can’t read it.

    But I tell you Jasons pretty good these days. You might be feeling put upon but he usually lets these things roll.

    But these are conservative/classical liberal/ near-libertarians.

    These aren’t commie-witch-hunters. They don’t like dudes PILING ON. They don’t like these mindless leftist lynchings.

    It will offend their sense of justice if you start abusing someone, with little cause, whose already taken enough mindless abuse for ten lifetimes.

    And it kind of offends me too. Just a little bit. The idea of it.

    But then I didn’t SEE what you said.

    But look.

    Hang out (not that I can tell you that. Only Jason and c8to can).

    You seem to be well-informed on stuff so I hope you hang out and don’t get too offended at being edited.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 4:13 pm

  372. JC, JC, JC
    For heaven’s sake, some of us were looking forward to dinner in a few hours …

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 4:14 pm

  373. It was me doing most of the editing, GMB, Jason only did it once. And right now I’m sick and miserable off work and am probably more sensative than usual.

    PP has lots of good stuff to offer, as I keep sayin.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 4:19 pm

  374. Jason.

    This PP seems pretty smart and well-read.

    I just cannot make out whats going on.

    Has he been hassling our conservative babes?

    Where’s the payoff in that?

    I can’t see no sense to it.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 4:21 pm

  375. Hey Graeme
    Have you been checking into your own blog lately? You’re getting hammered over there.

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 4:22 pm

  376. skepticlawyer has explained it above, Graeme. It was in relation to stuff arising from her post so I let her handle it.

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 4:24 pm

  377. I’ll let them run wild for awhile.

    You know.

    To attract a bit of traffic.

    I think folks were getting a bit punch-shy.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 4:24 pm

  378. Maybe they were gettin scared of you GMB. You’re a scary fella. But you better make sure they ain’t wreckin your blog either.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 4:28 pm

  379. GMB – have you read your daily Financial Review?

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 4:35 pm

  380. Is “PP” McGuiness? Watch for Russian bank references in the thread ‘o doom.

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 4:35 pm

  381. Sinclair
    what are you alluding to?

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 4:37 pm

  382. Nope, Paddy would post under his own name, CL, or an easily recognisable sig.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 4:38 pm

  383. Sinclair, how’d the First Communion go, sartorially speaking?

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 4:39 pm

  384. I don’t know how techno-savvy PP McG is. I doubt it.

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 4:39 pm

  385. Just kidding about Paddy, folks.

    The grouchy ex-Pushist man in black himself would use his trademark “Padraic P. McGuinness” byline I dare say. Anyway, I’d be surprised if he didn’t think blogs were to journals what Dawkins universities are to the Sandstones.

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 4:49 pm

  386. “GMB – have you read your daily Financial Review?”

    No.

    I’m not always able to pinch it from the office.

    Have you got an article in it today fella?

    And hows that third Bat Out Of Hell?

    The problem always is the low output of the genius Jim Steinman.

    Since the early 80’s its like he can only write about 1 song a year or less.

    So he keeps re-working them.

    I diagnosed him with ADD a while back.

    Is there much new material there?

    Still even if there is some of the old stuff with the fat man doing it its likely to be superior.

    He always handles it the way you expect he would have when the two first met.

    He always handles these mini-dramas like he’s still doing Shakespeare in the park.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 4:49 pm

  387. To whom it may concern:

    I am not now, and never have been, Padraic P. McGuiness.

    Yours sincerely,
    R.Manne

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 4:59 pm

  388. One thing you’ve got to give Paddy, Currency Lad, is his sense of style.
    Takes a man to wear a beret these days.

    Liam

    October 26, 2006 at 5:00 pm

  389. Here’s an amusing theory for the economists present: Paul Krugman: Contrary Indicator.

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 5:00 pm

  390. First communion was quite interesting. The guy playing the electric guitar had a tie. I think the guy playing the drums might also have had tie, but he wasn’t facing the audience. I also suspect the words of the apostles creed have changed since I read William Barclay’s book – mind that was in the early 80s. The nephew had a good day – one little boy had black pants, white shirt and a boy-tie, nobody else. Afterwards we went to the brother-in-laws place where I got sunburnt across the head. Message from above, ‘gee sinc, long time no see’ or ‘take that you blashemous little s…’?

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 5:00 pm

  391. Probably true, Liam. 😉

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 5:01 pm

  392. Sounds like you had a good one, anyway, Sinc.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 5:04 pm

  393. The Bat is gooood. Not sure ‘it’s all coming back to me’ is as good as Pandora’s box, but ‘in the land of the pig the butcher is king’ and ‘seize the night’ are CALSSICS. up there with ‘more than you deserve’ (dead ringer) and ‘for crying out load’ (bat 1). Steinman is a god and meatloaf is his vocalist. (Steinman himself sings worse than Dylan. err no. Nobody sings worse than Dylan, but you get the idea).

    AFR ran a piece on flat tax today, with large tax free threashold to make it ‘fair’.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 5:04 pm

  394. Can you email me some good bits? I’ll do a blogpost on it.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 5:06 pm

  395. Electric guitar and drums? Oy – how vulgar.

    Anyway, I’m glad it sort of worked out, Sinclair.

    C.L.

    October 26, 2006 at 5:06 pm

  396. “. Nobody sings worse than Dylan, but you get the idea”

    I’m warning you, Sinks. I believe in free speech but even I have my limits ….

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 5:06 pm

  397. If you are partial to trading US stocks a great contrary indicator is the NY Times Business section. Whenever those dudes are bearish stocks i place that at the top of my indicator to use as as buy signal. Didn’t know that Paul K was also being used. Hmmmmmmm.

    Pauly has been bearish the US economy since Bush took office. He’s a joke.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 5:14 pm

  398. “AFR ran a piece on flat tax today, with large tax free threashold to make it ‘fair’.”

    With flexible wages we can look to slow money-and-total-spending-growth for fairness.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
    Right.

    So there is at least two new songs.

    When its Steinman thats good enough.

    Actually I REALLY dug that Pandoras Box album.

    But when you look at it EVEN THAT was thin in material.

    Half an album really.

    I have some new drugs that could help this boy out.

    With the right pharmaceuticals Jim could have 5 albums of entirely new songs out by the end of the decade.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 5:22 pm

  399. Ummm, GMB, what pharmaceuticals do you mean?

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 5:37 pm

  400. There is absolutely no way my last deleted comment was “actionable”. This is now just censorship, plain and simple. Not saying you don’t have the right to do it (it is your site) but you are doing it.

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 5:38 pm

  401. Yep, I am doing it PP. And it wasn’t actionable at all. But I am doing it.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 5:40 pm

  402. PP.

    Who owned Channel Nine?

    How rich was he?

    How much bullshit went down over all that stuff?

    Do you suppose that people want to spend their whole life wallowing in this sort of bullshit years after the event……. for what purpose?

    For the purpose of not getting on with life…..

    Supposing if Channel Nine wants to try reissue this sort of thing…

    I don’t know whether they will face a challenge or not.

    But my attitude would be to slap down anyone who was wanting some sort of endless witch-hunt.

    Just slap them down VERY hard.

    I know over in leftist land when you have a black man to hang… or a homosexual that needs outing… when all the people are gathered around and everyone is sneering at the victim….

    I know that over in leftist-land when one piece of twine breaks they send the little girl off to the old cowshed to get another.

    “This time make sure its a GREEN piece of twine” they would say.

    But if you get yourself in trouble carrying on with this sort of endlessly vindictive bullshit you’ll get a VERY bad reaction on this part of the ether.

    “Yours sincerely,
    R.Manne”

    Yeah well MANNE had his own problems. Before that incident I saw this guy getting pushed around and abused on TV for no good reason.

    He was looking like a scared puppy in new surroundings.

    Didn’t have a damn clue who to trust and probably suspected that us Gentiles would just as soon as turn him into soap.

    This was an intra-lefty-intellectuals fight. Had very little to do with the author.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 5:43 pm

  403. ‘Blind as a bat’ is pretty good too. He pre-released ‘the monster is loose’ so iIhaven’t listened to it again. So, let’s say, at least four to five good songs. All up a good album. Pandora’s Box is excellent but flopped – ‘Safe sex’ done by Meatloaf would be very good. The soundtrack to ‘Streets of Fire’ has a couple of Steinman songs as well (the group Fire Inc. overlaps with the Pandora’s box group).

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 5:48 pm

  404. I thought drums, and electric guitars, and things were a bit much in a church service, but I’m not a believer. Those of my relatives who are believers all thought it was marvelous. So there you have it – too conservative to go to church 🙂 ‘It’s not me who has changed, it’s society’ 🙂

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 5:52 pm

  405. “Pandora’s Box is excellent but flopped – ‘Safe sex’ done by Meatloaf would be very good.”

    Yeah but safe sex is a sheilas song really isn’t it.

    The Streets of Fire songs had some good ideas and stuff.

    But the arrangements and the productions sounded like Walter Hill didn’t give the slopoke enough time.

    Sounded too manufactured and lame.

    But you still had that Steinman power seeping through.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 5:52 pm

  406. Actually GMB my last deleted post simply mentioned the fact that the defamatory interview is still available at ninemsn, so if SL wants to sue it’s a target rich environment.

    read this fast before deleted.

    i expect to be banned soon for challenging the High Priesthood, so cya!

    PP

    October 26, 2006 at 5:52 pm

  407. Actually I liked PP’s Robert Manne gag. Especially after people were speculating that he was Paddy McGuinness.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 5:55 pm

  408. Dude.

    I’m trying to reach out to you.

    I’m trying to reason with you.

    Just what is your fucking problem?

    Her man would stand up for her and the rest of us would give him any assistance he needs and she is a lawyer and can fashion the muscle end of the country to her will.

    So there is no worry about her.

    But what’s wrong with YOU pal?

    What is YOUR problem?

    I’m sure that there are lefties out there still wanting to piss on Joe McCarthy’s grave decades after he was martyred.

    But surely you can be lead to a place where you can quietly think about it and realise that it is YOU that has the problem and no-one that you have-it-in-for has done the wrong thing by you………..(yet).

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 6:00 pm

  409. PP
    Stop being such a mean spirited git.
    Firstly this is nothing to do with your stepping on the High Priesthood’s toes.
    I don’t believe in censorship but I’m not the one affected here, skeptic is, so it’s not my place to stop her and therefore it’s her call if she thinks what you’re posting is sufficiently distressing to want to remove. I would allow the same discretion to any of the other bloggers around here as I’m not in their position.

    You’ve been going on about this pig business since 3 pm, sl has basically admitted she stuffed up and I’d say she stuffed up too but the stuff up was over some light banter between her and GMB over that pig picture.

    The actionability of the statements was not so much in your reproduction of her past words but in the inferences you were drawing between them and this little tiff this afternoon.

    Now I can’t read SL’s mind and I can’t read her email so I have bugger all knowledge of these pictures (such an issue of national importance when contrasted with the rather lightweight issues around here innit?). So I can only go by the testimony of the people involved (in this case only one – SL as recipient of this picture) and I would suggest the same applies to you unless you happen to know better. And that’s the end of the matter as far as i’m concerned.

    So I don’t know what game you’re playing here. You seem too intelligent to be one of those snot nosed private school dripping wet tossers from Crikey looking for more piffle to send their milch cows but you seem to be playing the same game.

    Jason Soon

    October 26, 2006 at 6:02 pm

  410. Thanks Jason.

    And yes I probably am being sensitive but the first post was open & shut actionable. May I suggest PP you google ‘statute of limitations’ and see what it tells you.

    And yes I stuffed up. I do it reasonably regularly (despite best efforts). I take it you don’t.

    skepticlawyer

    October 26, 2006 at 6:15 pm

  411. Is PP James Wheeldon 111 LLB (hons) Harvard, who is unable to use the Sydeny tunnel because his head is too big to fit.

    PP, it’s a pic of a big pig. Who gives a shit who and where it was taken. Worry about Fred A wanting to regulate the labor again, doofus.

    jc

    October 26, 2006 at 6:18 pm

  412. “but the stuff up was over some light banter between her and GMB over that pig picture.”

    Ha Ha Ha.

    Is this what that was about?

    Sister they are watching you always.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 7:40 pm

  413. ‘Yeah but safe sex is a sheilas song really isn’t it.’

    I don’t know. A sensitive new guy, like ourselves for example, could sing ‘Safe sex’. But if it were too girly, the song could easily be a duet.

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 7:44 pm

  414. No it doesn’t make it as a duet.

    Many good songs can be wrecked by being made a duet.

    But I saw about 5 seconds on the TV of Meat Loaf making a duet of its all coming back to me.

    And I thought… yeah that could work.

    I’m dirty on duets from when Kenny Rogers and Sheena Easten did this cover of….

    “We got tonight,
    Who needs tommorrow..”

    You know the one. The original escapes me but he was just about to make it big.

    Anyway it was an extended argument to get the girls pants off.

    And a mighty persuasive argument it was too.

    But if you get BOTH Kenny and Sheena singing it why are they waiting around and who is the extended argument for?

    You see thats what I like about the Steinman songs more generally.

    You have this total integration of all elements.

    I remember being unable to get a job and hanging out in Freemantle.

    And listening to that Otis Redding number

    Now Otis sung it like the words said it like he was really downcast.

    But then this longhair sings it and everyone is saying its better then the original.

    But the dumb bastard interprets it with so much PASSION that it defeats the whole reality of the song.

    LIke with that much passion dudes going to get off his ass and get a job.

    I really liked a lot of the old Alice Cooper stuff too.

    For different reasons I liked Zappa and was a real Prince junkie.

    But I don’t know….

    The guys you really like can be thin on the ground.

    So I very much understand the enthusiasm when finally a new Steinman number comes out.

    GMB

    October 26, 2006 at 8:13 pm

  415. ‘You know the one.’

    Yes, the horror, the horror.

    Kenny had a bad habit of this. Remember ‘islands in the sun’ with Dolly Parton?

    Sinclair Davidson

    October 26, 2006 at 9:55 pm


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